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1069895 Posts in 71006 Topics- by 18773 Members - Latest Member: deezel901
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The Trombone ForumRecent Posts
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 41 
 on: Today at 12:31 PM 
Started by BillO - Last post by John the Theologian
Yes, I agree that can happen.  But not always, and in my circles it's the exception rather than the rule.

However, I've never heard, for example's sake, a devout RC say something like "You know, Those Muslims don't worship God like I do, but I can see how their faith is just as valid and true for them as mine is for me."
Your off on that count John.  "Religion is inherently violent" never entered my mind in that response. Besides, I've stated it before, I don't think religion is inherently violent.
Was there unanimous agreement at the end of that discussion"  Or is it sufficient for you to state a view is wrong, and that makes it absolutely wrong.

I agree that we didn't resolve it, but I thought this thread was going in a different direction.

BTW, many politicos that I know would never say that what they consider a false political view is "true for them."-- referring to the person holding that belief.  I've seen plenty of politicos that would argue that one is completely an ignoramus who is helping foul up the whole country by holding and voting according to those "completely wrong" political beliefs.

 42 
 on: Today at 12:28 PM 
Started by BillO - Last post by BillO
To get back to the original point...

If you take 100 pictures of different male or female passport photos, put them each at 1% opacity, and overlay them all over top of each other... you will wind up with a composite portrait that looks an awful lot like a person, and yet, looks different than any of the individual people involved.

So the question becomes, what is this composite portrait for? To identify the most common features?
That actually works really well Bob.  Why didn't I think of putting it that way?  Yes, the result would definitely be a picture we could all agree looks like a human.  But I'm not sure we'll get 100 religions chiming in here.  It would be awesome though.

 43 
 on: Today at 12:25 PM 
Started by BillO - Last post by B0B
To get back to the original point...

If you take 100 pictures of different male or female passport photos, put them each at 1% opacity, and overlay them all over top of each other... you will wind up with a composite portrait that looks an awful lot like a person, and yet, looks different than any of the individual people involved.

So the question becomes, what is this composite portrait for? To identify the most common features? ie. that most people, from a variety of cultures, languages, and places all feel an impulse that there is something greater? That those who don't often think of themselves as the highest point they are willing to acknowledge?

 44 
 on: Today at 12:23 PM 
Started by BillO - Last post by BillO
I have seen far to many people demonize political opponents as evil people to believe that they are fundamentally different.
Yes, I agree that can happen.  But not always, and in my circles it's the exception rather than the rule.

However, I've never heard, for example's sake, a devout RC say something like "You know, Those Muslims don't worship God like I do, but I can see how their faith is just as valid and true for them as mine is for me."

Quote
You seem to be going back to some variation of your "religion is inherently violent" argument
Your off on that count John.  "Religion is inherently violent" never entered my mind in that response. Besides, I've stated it before, I don't think religion is inherently violent.

Quote
and some of us have already challenged that so I don't think we need to challenge it again here.
Was there unanimous agreement at the end of that discussion"  Or is it sufficient for you to state a view is wrong, and that makes it absolutely wrong.

 45 
 on: Today at 12:08 PM 
Started by BillO - Last post by BillO
His POV has been severely challenged.
Of course it has.  It is not main-stream Christian.  Why would this surprise anyone?

 46 
 on: Today at 12:07 PM 
Started by BillO - Last post by John the Theologian
Yes, absolutely.

Using the political argument.  We may not agree that Trump is a good president but we can usually convince each other that our views justify our position.  One person that is keen on getting a low paying, future less job may love Trump for shutting down the Mexican border, throwing out environmental laws to bring back coal consumption and putting tariffs on foreign lumber. Another that is a staunch tree-hugger may think her is a bad president for nearly exactly the same reasons.  However, they can certainly see how each pundit's perspective leads them to their opinion on Trump.

The religious argument is more analogous to two people that support Trump but each finding the other reprehensible because they support him for different reasons.

I couldn't disagree more.  I have seen far to many people demonize political opponents as evil people to believe that they are fundamentally different.  Yes, members of Congress can drink coffee togetherin a collegial manner, but then we can discuss on this forum-- at least some of us can.  You seem to be going back to some variation of your "religion is inherently violent" argument and some of us have already challenged that so I don't think we need to challenge it again here.

 47 
 on: Today at 12:01 PM 
Started by BillO - Last post by timothy42b
Like i said, I stay out of religious discussions as they generally lead to people getting mad at each other over something that cannot be proved or disproved. I read the book, thought it was interesting, and shared the information here. I don't care whether anyone else reads it or not.

His book and those of Elaine Pagels are well worth reading, because they give you a viewpoint you would never suspect from the orthodoxy.

By all means read both sides of it, critically.  

You should also check out Spong.  His logic isn't as detailed but he's quite readable, and most of what he says is mainstream liberal Christian.  Not all, he's got a weird theory about liturgy and the gospels that's intriguing and well argued, but he didn't quite convince me.  

 48 
 on: Today at 12:00 PM 
Started by BillO - Last post by BillO
Like i said, I stay out of religious discussions as they generally lead to people getting mad at each other over something that cannot be proved or disproved. I read the book, thought it was interesting, and shared the information here. I don't care whether anyone else reads it or not.
No one here seems to be getting mad - yet.  I think we can keep it that way.

 49 
 on: Today at 12:00 PM 
Started by Bevador - Last post by MaestroHound
I use a 354 lead pipe in my shires and I love the combination.

Yes--as good as 354 with different pipes, its original pipe isn't half bad. And if for any reason you need one, it costs less than $10 new from Hickeys! (Shipping does push it over $10, but still)

 50 
 on: Today at 11:59 AM 
Started by BillO - Last post by BillO
You seem to imply that strongly held religious beliefs operate in a different way than other strongly held beliefs.
Yes, absolutely.

Using the political argument.  We may not agree that Trump is a good president but we can usually convince each other that our views justify our position.  One person that is keen on getting a low paying, future less job may love Trump for shutting down the Mexican border, throwing out environmental laws to bring back coal consumption and putting tariffs on foreign lumber. Another that is a staunch tree-hugger may think he is a bad president for nearly exactly the same reasons.  However, they can certainly see how each pundit's perspective leads them to their opinion on Trump.

The religious argument is more analogous to two people that support Trump but each finding the other reprehensible because they support him for different reasons.

The political pundit's can agree to disagree, the religious can't seem to agree to agree.

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