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The Trombone ForumHorns, Gear, and EquipmentMouthpieces(Moderators: BGuttman, Doug Elliott) Hammond bass rims vs greg black bass rims
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jbeckett

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« on: Jun 12, 2017, 07:45PM »

Are Hammond bass rims wider? Like an elliott LB114W (w denoting wide)? I need something in one piece and can't seem to play on modular pieces for some reason.
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« Reply #1 on: Jun 12, 2017, 07:52PM »

Nope. Hammond rims are like regular Schilke or Elliott width rims.

Are you looking for something in the Schilke 60 size? Elliott is only one of a handful that makes mouthpieces in that size with a wide rim option.
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« Reply #2 on: Jun 12, 2017, 08:20PM »

I'm going for a 28.5 or 28.75mm diameter rim, but a wider, more tenor like, rim. So, basically not one that will cut into my face and be very narrow, like a 60 diameter rim.
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« Reply #3 on: Jun 12, 2017, 08:44PM »

I'm going for a 28.5 or 28.75mm diameter rim, but a wider, more tenor like, rim. So, basically not one that will cut into my face and be very narrow, like a 60 diameter rim.

Fergusons
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jbeckett

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« Reply #4 on: Jun 12, 2017, 09:00PM »

Yup. I love my jeff Reynolds. But it doesn't fit well in a 50 slide.
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« Reply #5 on: Jun 12, 2017, 09:19PM »

Yup. I love my jeff Reynolds. But it doesn't fit well in a 50 slide.
Really? Isn't the Reynolds just a standard Morse taper? Sounds like your leadpipe is messed up...
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« Reply #6 on: Jun 12, 2017, 10:11PM »

I play on a Hammond 19BL.  Great rim.  Medium wide, Schilke-like.  You might try the 20BL. 
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« Reply #7 on: Jun 12, 2017, 10:56PM »

Hammond rims are definitely a little wider than GB rims, at least the ones I have.

Give the Rath 1 1/4W a shot too.
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Matt K

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« Reply #8 on: Jun 13, 2017, 03:24AM »

Are Hammond bass rims wider? Like an elliott LB114W (w denoting wide)? I need something in one piece and can't seem to play on modular pieces for some reason.

How do you know you can't play on modular pieces? Perhaps the thing you think you like (the wide rim) is leading you to evaulate it unfavorably compared to other non modular pieces? If you do like the rim,you could always have it threaded onto another underpart.
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« Reply #9 on: Jun 13, 2017, 05:32AM »

Griego GP
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jbeckett

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« Reply #10 on: Jun 13, 2017, 06:15AM »

How do you know you can't play on modular pieces? Perhaps the thing you think you like (the wide rim) is leading you to evaulate it unfavorably compared to other non modular pieces? If you do like the rim,you could always have it threaded onto another underpart.

I feel the rim cut on my lips. The 114w and 113w. Nothing against Doug. He makes great stuff.
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« Reply #11 on: Jun 13, 2017, 06:16AM »

Pipe is good. Greg blacks fit with no wiggle at all. The Reynolds is 15 years old. I'm guessing it was a bit longer.
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« Reply #12 on: Jun 13, 2017, 06:32AM »

To my chops, Hammonds feel a little rounder and wider than similarly-sized Bachs and Schilkes. Much more comfortable. Greg Blacks feel to me about the same width but not as sharp an inner bite: perhaps the high point of the rim is in a slightly different place than a Bach or Schilke rims. Maybe they're a bit flatter? Doug's standard rims feel comfortable to me--I haven't tried his w rims on bass.

I've had several Bach horns and played on a few. Some receivers I've noticed fit a mpc shank snugly. Some Bach horns from the 80's and 90's seem to have had the leadpipe put in place and then flared out to leave no gap between the outer wall of the leadpipe and the inner slide/cork barrel assembly. It distorts the shape of the reciever. I haven't seen that as much on older horns, pre-70's. I've pulled most of the factory-installed leadpipes and used either other Bach pipes (long or long-open) or other maker's pipes. With a pull ring or threads, you don't notice when there's a gap, but they feel as though they fit snugly.

My Reynolds mouthpiece fits perfectly in my M/K Drawing Bach pipes, both the Roberts and the B50. It also fit perfectly with the Brass Ark pipes I used to play.
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« Reply #13 on: Jun 13, 2017, 08:16AM »

I feel the rim cut on my lips. The 114w and 113w. Nothing against Doug. He makes great stuff.

Yikes! They're definitely of the same series?  I'd probably have him take a look at it just to be sure, that doesn't sound right. I've got a dozen of his pieces and I can't feel the cup on any of them.  Even the tuba piece I have. 
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« Reply #14 on: Jun 13, 2017, 08:30AM »

all lb cups and rims, unfortunately.  i need a greg black 1-1/8 m with a wide rim.  honestly, im headed to charlotte tomorrow.  may have to call him to pay a visit.
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« Reply #15 on: Jun 13, 2017, 08:40AM »

Interesting.  Yeah, if you can go down there in person, that certainly makes sense!  I'm not sure if you've seen, but forum member HouBassBone (Zac) has a good relationship with Greg and may be worth contacting as well. He seems to have a good track record of getting custom stuff from Greg if none of the stock stuff works. 
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« Reply #16 on: Jun 13, 2017, 09:21AM »

Greg has definitely made custom wide rims for people. He's very happy to accommodate custom orders.
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« Reply #17 on: Jun 16, 2017, 09:11AM »

The rim on the Hammond feels a lot more like a tenor to me compared to a Bach bass mouthpiece. The Bach mouthpiece is super thin and really round, and the Hammond rim is noticably wider to the eye. I have two other Hammonds and their rims are all ultra consistent.

I started on a regular Bach 1-1/4 G and later moved to a Hammond 20BL.
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« Reply #18 on: Jun 17, 2017, 05:00AM »

Visited Gregs shop outside of Charlotte nc this past Thursday. We now have a solution. It's custom, but it works, and is way better than the ferguson that I was playing on. It'll be a few weeks, but this piece is going to fit me well and make me chops better for doubling. The ferguson went too far into the Venturi, which was confirmed by greg.  We're on the right path with the piece he is making me and I can't wait to try it. Thanks for your input and help gents.

JB
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the most pure sound... go for that. The 24 carat sound...

                        Jay Friedman
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