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Author Topic: LA Phil Second Trombone  (Read 1935 times)
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Bobmranger
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« on: Jul 08, 2017, 04:47PM »

Any information on the auditions ?
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Posaunus
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« Reply #1 on: Jul 08, 2017, 05:09PM »

Be patient
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bbone1
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« Reply #2 on: Jul 12, 2017, 02:20PM »

No winner was chosen.
There will be another audition.
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MikeBMiller
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« Reply #3 on: Jul 13, 2017, 07:03AM »

Now I am just an amateur schmuck with no expertise in choosing players for the finest orchestras in the world, but it seems to me that any group of players that could even make the cut to audition for LA would be among the finest players in the USA, if not the world. I just find it hard to believe that none of these guys (or ladies) is good enough to do this job. Just my 2 cents and I'm sure the LA Phil won't be coming to me for advice any time soon.
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mbarbier
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« Reply #4 on: Jul 13, 2017, 09:29AM »

Now I am just an amateur schmuck with no expertise in choosing players for the finest orchestras in the world, but it seems to me that any group of players that could even make the cut to audition for LA would be among the finest players in the USA, if not the world. I just find it hard to believe that none of these guys (or ladies) is good enough to do this job. Just my 2 cents and I'm sure the LA Phil won't be coming to me for advice any time soon.

It's not a question of being good enough for the highest paid second trombone gig in the world, it's a question of showing up that day and playing like it. From the person I know who was on the committee, they didn't feel like anyone played well enough and it was really frustrating for them because they know there were people there who could play that well but none of them did.

From talking to old teachers that seems to be a common theme when no winner is chosen- no one showed up that day, in every round and WON the job.
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Posaunus
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« Reply #5 on: Jul 13, 2017, 12:00PM »

It must have indeed been disappointing to the selection committee to not hear a clear winner.  This is truly a plum orchestra job, and there are many fine trombonists who would (should) fight tooth & nail to land the position. 

I am still disappointed that Jörgen van Rijen did not win (or did not accept, depending on whose story you believe) the LA Phil principal trombone position - I love his playing. 
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BassBoneFL

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« Reply #6 on: Jul 13, 2017, 12:15PM »

Quite often it is not a matter of "no one being good enough" but more like the committee and/or music director couldn't reach consensus on which one would be the right one for the position.
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Harold Van Schaik
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« Reply #7 on: Jul 13, 2017, 01:50PM »

So is the available pool of prospective winners going to change significantly between this audition and the next? Granted, they could invite me next time, but I would hate to give up my spot as principal trombone of my local community band.
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bigbassbone1

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« Reply #8 on: Jul 13, 2017, 01:56PM »

So is the available pool of prospective winners going to change significantly between this audition and the next? Granted, they could invite me next time, but I would hate to give up my spot as principal trombone of my local community band.


Probably not if they do not make it an international audition, but someone from last time might turn up and play significantly better than they did previously. If not, then you may have no choice but to give your community band some bad news.
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Burgerbob

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« Reply #9 on: Jul 13, 2017, 02:32PM »

Jorgen was definitely good enough. But the orchestra is off just fine with David, who is an amazing player and musician (and most importantly, a great human).  

As for the second audition, no one played well enough to win this time around. It's as simple as that.
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« Reply #10 on: Jul 13, 2017, 02:33PM »


Probably not if they do not make it an international audition, but someone from last time might turn up and play significantly better than they did previously. If not, then you may have no choice but to give your community band some bad news.

Reminds me of an interview I saw with Phil Myers.  It was from an interview he did with Michael Davis, and he told a story of his winning the NYP horn audition, after playing really poorly in his round.   IIRC, he mentioned that no winner came from the audition,  and when the MD heard that was the result, he rattled off a few names he wanted to hear himself, and Myers was one of them.  He played great in the 'do-over'  and  won the job.  So one never knows what can happen one audition to the next.  

It was an interesting interview (in two or three parts on YouTube IIRC.).  If I can locate it I will post a link.  
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BassBoneFL

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« Reply #11 on: Jul 13, 2017, 03:09PM »

As for the second audition, no one played well enough to win this time around. It's as simple as that.

It may not be as simple as that. It may be that they could not agree on which one did. I have been involved in that from BOTH sides of the screen a few times.

Before I won a job, it baffled me how you could hold an audition and not pick a winner. After having been on the other side of the screen and seen what takes place and how things work, I'm surprised it doesn't happen more often. More often than not it comes from lack of agreement on the committee than lack of quality candidates.
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Harold Van Schaik
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« Reply #12 on: Jul 13, 2017, 03:32PM »

Talking with Jim and the section, it was about no showing up ready to win. But you may be right.
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MikeBMiller
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« Reply #13 on: Jul 13, 2017, 03:37PM »


 If not, then you may have no choice but to give your community band some bad news.

They are really going to hate that.
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BassBoneFL

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« Reply #14 on: Jul 13, 2017, 05:28PM »

Talking with Jim and the section, it was about no showing up ready to win. But you may be right.

That can sometimes be code for "there was no consensus".
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Harold Van Schaik
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« Reply #15 on: Jul 17, 2017, 08:05PM »

From my experience of sitting on audition panels, everyone on that panel is really looking to fill the position being auditioned that day, for a number of reasons (other than just "filling the job", which I can elaborate more on, if anyone is interested)

It does happen that on some auditions no-one turns up that is good enough. This doesn't mean that they play poorly, but it may be that they don't play an excerpt(s) stylistically "correct" for the orchestra. Players on panels often have very defined ideas as to how an excerpt should go, and even though a candidate may play it very well, if it doesn't match the panels idea, then the person doesn't "get the nod". Sometimes a panel will ask someone to play an excerpt again slightly differently. The candidate's ability to adapt, and take on board suggestions under pressure can also be a "make or break" factor.

When an audition is held, and no-one is successful, it is a heartbreaking outcome for the panel, too. They want to fill the chair, and resume to a sense of (new) normal in their work space. Not finding an appropriate candidate prolongs the problems associated with not having a full-time player in the job.

FWIW...
M   
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Burgerbob

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« Reply #16 on: Jul 17, 2017, 09:43PM »


It does happen that on some auditions no-one turns up that is good enough. This doesn't mean that they play poorly, but it may be that they don't play an excerpt(s) stylistically "correct" for the orchestra. Players on panels often have very defined ideas as to how an excerpt should go, and even though a candidate may play it very well, if it doesn't match the panels idea, then the person doesn't "get the nod". Sometimes a panel will ask someone to play an excerpt again slightly differently. The candidate's ability to adapt, and take on board suggestions under pressure can also be a "make or break" factor.

FWIW...
M   

Actually, at their ITF panel, they spoke about how they are annoyed at this. They just want people to play well, not worry about the intricacies of the LA Phil style per se.
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« Reply #17 on: Jul 17, 2017, 10:58PM »

Actually, at their ITF panel, they spoke about how they are annoyed at this. They just want people to play well, not worry about the intricacies of the LA Phil style per se.

The way I read Matt's post, I don't believe he is implying that players are trying to out guess the panel by playing the excerpts other than way the players believes is correct. Rather, the player's interpretation is not in sync with the panels views of correct style. As has been mentioned by others, it can be more complicated than just not good enough.
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« Reply #18 on: Jul 18, 2017, 03:20AM »

Actually, at their ITF panel, they spoke about how they are annoyed at this. They just want people to play well, not worry about the intricacies of the LA Phil style per se.

I have heard Andrew Bain say basically this on multiple occasions also. He went so far as to say that he thought L.A. was an orchestra more open to adapting as a whole to a new player who brings something different, than most other big orchestras who have strong traditions in particular sounds. Not positive or negative, just interesting.
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