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Author Topic: Jazz trombone for concert band  (Read 2758 times)
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harrison.t.reed
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« Reply #20 on: Aug 18, 2017, 04:17PM »

This!!!

Who exactly decided we had to play a large bore on 1st, lest we be called wimps?

I used to have a silver plated 1951 6H (which I regretted selling the minute I sold it...). I sold it to a guy who was studying at the college where I was rehearsing, so instead of bringing my 42, one day, I brought the 6H for him and played the rehearsal on it. My section was very skeptical, until we started playing (Rachmaninoff Symphony no. 2). It was the nicest blend and color palette we had in any of that program's rehearsals. Very eye-opening

Denis Wick really helped make it happen, but it was already a thing in the US before that.

I think he'd be pretty hard to argue with. Start with Denis.
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« Reply #21 on: Aug 19, 2017, 01:36PM »

Denis Wick really helped make it happen, but it was already a thing in the US before that.

I think he'd be pretty hard to argue with. Start with Denis.

I think Dennis Wick loved .547 horns because he had a huge overbite and needed a big mouthpiece. Large mouthpieces need large horns.
So disappeared small bores trombones from the symphony orchestra. Then they were replaced by an alto trombone Eb, which sounds worse than a small bore tenor. (IMHO)
But Dennis Wick was lucky and he did not play alto trombone.
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Torobone

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« Reply #22 on: Aug 19, 2017, 03:27PM »

Well, this depends on the conductor and the section.

I subbed in a pretty good concert band, and I used my 42B on that occasion. Later, when I decided to join the band, I noticed that most players were using King 3B or equivalent so I started using my .508 891Z.

Things were going well, but when we about the play a more classical program, I brought out my 42B for a rehearsal. At break, I spoke to the conductor, and he simply said: "I need a lead trombone, not a first trombone." OK, so I put the 42B away and I've used my 891Z ever since.

I also subbed in an orchestra under the same conductor, and I asked which sound he wanted. He still wanted the brighter sound, so my 42B is still in its case.
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Martin Hubel
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« Reply #23 on: Aug 19, 2017, 03:45PM »

Thanks for all of the input! It has helped a lot!
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Radar

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« Reply #24 on: Sep 01, 2017, 05:29PM »

Denis Wick really helped make it happen, but it was already a thing in the US before that.

I think he'd be pretty hard to argue with. Start with Denis.
Yes Emory Remington at Eastman School of Music, as well as principal Trombone with the Rochester Philharmonic worked with CG Conn on the development of the 88H a little bit before Wick, and his influence on US orchestral players, especially those training at Eastman was widespread in the US.
 
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« Reply #25 on: Sep 01, 2017, 06:02PM »

Denis Wick really helped make it happen, but it was already a thing in the US before that.

I think he'd be pretty hard to argue with. Start with Denis.

I vaguely remember hearing a story about DW hearing large bores when Remington was in the UK.
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« Reply #26 on: Sep 02, 2017, 03:27AM »

The Yamaha 354 IS a great "jazz Bb" trombone. "Student" label be damned!  Max Acree, who I consider to be an up-and-coming giant in modern jazz trombone, plays one exclusively!
You might think about a larger bore. Then you'll have everything covered.
Yes! If your horn is in good shape you allready have a good horn! That horn is in no way a lesser quality horn!
Use it for every thing untill you do find that you might need a arger horn in orchestra.
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« Reply #27 on: Sep 05, 2017, 01:38PM »

When my son reports for college football camp he brings his Conn 6H (.500) so he can get some practice in before fall auditions. For the Wind Symphony he plays a Conn 88HTO (.547) and for big band he plays a King 6B (.562 bass).  This winter when he tours Europe with the Wind Orchestra he'll be playing the Conn 88HTO.  I guess you play what your director wants.  Listening to the two big bands at my son's school trombone section in one of the bands is made up primarily of large bore instruments, in my son's band it's King 2B on lead, King 3B's on 2nd and 3rd and my son's King 6B on bass; his band's trombone section sounds fantastic, the other band's trombone section sounds a bit unfocused to me.
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Davidus1

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« Reply #28 on: Feb 09, 2018, 08:35PM »

The Yamaha 354 IS a great "jazz Bb" trombone. "Student" label be damned!  Max Acree, who I consider to be an up-and-coming giant in modern jazz trombone, plays one exclusively!
You might think about a larger bore. Then you'll have everything covered.

What he said!  I play a 354 in a big band and in a concert band.  I do use a larger mouthpiece in the concert band but the horn does a great job.  I could pay a couple of thousand dollars and not really gain much.  The Yamaha 354s are an incredible value.  You can't go wrong with one.
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« Reply #29 on: Feb 11, 2018, 04:03AM »

Unless your playing in an extremely “serious” group, I can also verify that a .508 tenor is wonderful in a concert band.   In fact, it’s good for just about everything that doesn’t NEED and F attachment.   

I’ve recently consolidated to only one tenor and a bass, after years of playing lots of sizes. Mostly .525.  I am constantly amazed how well a .508 with a medium mouthpiece is just the right fit in so many situations. And it’s so easy to play.
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BGuttman
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« Reply #30 on: Feb 11, 2018, 06:03AM »

In most Community Bans nobody is going to make a fuss about what you are playing if you show you know how to play it.  If you are always in tune and on time you can be playing a kazoo and noboy is going to give a care (well, maybe a kazoo...).  I've played 1st in my Community Ban on a King 2B Silvertone (owned by the band), a Holton Stratodyne, a Bach 36C, and a Yamaha 682.  Nobody cared which horn I was playing.  I sounded like me on all of them. 

If you only own one trombone, you play it wherever you can.  The only time a small bore straight horn is a problem is when you encounter trigger notes in a 3rd part (or 4th in a Big Band).

We had a kid who was planning to major in jazz studies and played his Shires Dease on 1st trombone.  He sounded great.

Too many people listen with eyes rather than ears (yes, I was guilty of this once also).
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Bruce Guttman
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« Reply #31 on: Feb 11, 2018, 06:06AM »

Just get a good King 3B as has been mentioned. Unless you’re under, or succumb to, “peer pressure” you’ll survive.

For high school and college band music (concert or jazz) you’ll never see any 1st or 2nd parts that require a trigger horn...ever.

There might be one or two jazz charts with a 3rd part requiring a trigger. But unless you’re playing music especially composed for the Village Vanguard band or another special unit, you don’t need anything bigger than a .510 horn (.508, .509, or eve .500)

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BillO
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« Reply #32 on: Feb 11, 2018, 08:53AM »

If you only own one trombone, you play it wherever you can.
Yup.  For years all I had was my 4B.  It played in every seat at one time or another, even in pit.
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« Reply #33 on: Feb 11, 2018, 10:02AM »

Thanks for all of the input! It has helped a lot!
What make/model of horn have you been looking at?
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David Sullivan
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John Thomas
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« Reply #34 on: Feb 11, 2018, 12:16PM »

If your Yamaha is a YSL-354, it's fine for all those things you mentioned.  No need to buy another horn at all.

It depends on what size school you go to.  If you are not a music major the only one of those you would probably get into at large school is the marching band.  At a large school the pep band, jazz band, and main wind ensemble/concert bands are filled by auditions.  You would have to be a really good non music major to crack those groups. 

A small school would have more opportunities for you in all of those.  Jazz band and pep in most cases is by audition most of the time unless it is really small.  Concert band is just looking for players at most small schools.
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Davidus1

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« Reply #35 on: Feb 11, 2018, 03:47PM »

I'm playing on a Yamaha 354 in a concert band and a jazz band and it works just fine.  I use a larger piece in the concert band (6 3/4C) vs the big band (11c).  Its a great horn. Best wishes in your search.    :)
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