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The Trombone ForumHorns, Gear, and EquipmentInstruments(Moderators: tbone62, slide advantage) Conn 78H Bell With A Bach 36 Slide?
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Driswood

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« on: Aug 03, 2017, 10:58PM »

Curious. I know some makes are close enough to work. Will a 78 bell work with a 36 slide? Or the other way around?

Or an 88H/42 combo?

I figure you can modify tenons to make it work, but are bell and slide lengths too different for proper intonation?

Thanks,

Jerry Walker
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JWykell
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« Reply #1 on: Aug 04, 2017, 04:39AM »

I once borrowed an Elkhart 88h slide and used it with my 42b bell section while waiting to get my 42 slide fixed. I actually got a lot of compliments on my sound from that combo. I know there is variation from era to era with Bach slide tenons. That horn was from the early to mid eighties.
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Dukesboneman

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« Reply #2 on: Aug 04, 2017, 05:09AM »

Tuning might be a problem
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Horn Builder

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« Reply #3 on: Aug 04, 2017, 06:38AM »

Bach slides are longer than Conn, so there may be tuning issues (depending on where your personal pitch center is)

You already know about the different slide tenons. A Bach will go into a Conn receiver, but not the other way around. (Talking large bore here. May be doable on 525 horns.)

FWIW.
M
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Matthew Walker
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Driswood

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« Reply #4 on: Aug 04, 2017, 06:56AM »

Tuning might be a problem

What I was thinking.
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oslide

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« Reply #5 on: Aug 04, 2017, 07:00AM »

Curious. I know some makes are close enough to work. Will a 78 bell work with a 36 slide? Or the other way around?

Just checked briefly. The Bach tenon is slightly fatter than the Conn one. Thus the Bach tenon will stand out ca. 6 mm from the Conn bell connector, while the Conn tenon sits loose in the Bach. Threads are different.

Playingwise I wasn't convinced by any combination. A bit hollow sounding, difficult heights and depths. You should check closely before going this road.
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Phteven

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« Reply #6 on: Aug 04, 2017, 07:11AM »

I can't speak to the 78H/36 combo.  But I can speak to the 88H/42 combo.

I once bought an 8H bell section on eBay.  Really nice bell section actually, but I was frustrated because my 88H slide would not fit properly.  On a lark, I tried a 42 slide, and lo and behold, perfect fit.  Someone had refitted it to accept a 42 slide at some point.  Why?  I'll never know (it was from a pawn shop). 

Tuning WAS an issue, but not as much as you might think, it wasn't too difficult to adjust to.  But what was an issue was the sound was just completely dull and lifeless.  I think this is the problem with the frankenbone concept, the horn is designed as a whole, and while you might stumble on a unique combo that works GREAT, ocassionally you'll find a real dud.  I think that was the case of with the 8H/42 slide.  Maybe something about the larger crook on the 42 slide didn't jive with the 2-piece, red brass bell?  (Plenty of people have that kind of setup with a Shires or Edwards, and it seems to work pretty well)  Who knows. 
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Stan

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« Reply #7 on: Aug 04, 2017, 07:19AM »

I've soft-mounted an 8-inch Elkhart Conn bell (custom job, no model number) to my Bach 36 several times.  It works pretty well on that horn.  I'd have it permanently mounted if I played much tenor anymore.

Stan
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Full Pedal Trombonist

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« Reply #8 on: Aug 05, 2017, 10:55PM »

I have a 62H-ish slide that's on a 50B2O-ish bell section. pretty much a 50B2O with a Holton screw bell, but other slight mods. It plays better with the Conn-ish slide than it did with two different stock Bach slides ( for me ). Buuuuuut I used the same Conn-ish slide with a stock Bach bell section and everything was off. Like standing on one foot or sitting on a wobbly chair. The Bach slide was much better on the Bach bell. So who knows!
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Dukesboneman

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« Reply #9 on: Aug 06, 2017, 07:26AM »

Do you have the parts? 36 slide/78H bell?
I`ve always found that the Bach bells are a little shorter and the slides longer with the 78H being the opposite.
There`s more horn behind your head where the tuning slide is on a Conn than a Bach.
Both are great horns.
An older 78H has the same bore (.522) as your 34B.
Played this size for years (2 36`s and 3 78H`s)
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Driswood

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« Reply #10 on: Aug 08, 2017, 03:40AM »

Do you have the parts? 36 slide/78H bell?
I`ve always found that the Bach bells are a little shorter and the slides longer with the 78H being the opposite.
There`s more horn behind your head where the tuning slide is on a Conn than a Bach.
Both are great horns.
An older 78H has the same bore (.522) as your 34B.
Played this size for years (2 36`s and 3 78H`s)

Dave,

No, I don't have the parts. Not looking to do it, was just curious whether it would work. Loving my 34B, not looking!

I need to come down in the next couple weeks to hear one of your groups!

Jerry
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Dukesboneman

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« Reply #11 on: Aug 08, 2017, 05:00AM »

Things are kind of slow right now. I`ll let you know.
Just bought a new member to the family - Mint Condition 1966 Bach 12 (Mount Vernon Parts). Plays like a dream, slide like glass and an upper rang that is incredible
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Driswood

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« Reply #12 on: Aug 08, 2017, 06:28AM »

Things are kind of slow right now. I`ll let you know.
Just bought a new member to the family - Mint Condition 1966 Bach 12 (Mount Vernon Parts). Plays like a dream, slide like glass and an upper rang that is incredible

 Good!
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"Give a beggar a horse & he'll run over you"

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'65 Bach 34B
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