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The Trombone ForumHorns, Gear, and EquipmentMouthpieces(Moderators: BGuttman, Doug Elliott) Looking for a mouthpiece that's bigger than a Bach 1 1/4G but smaller than a 1G
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MoominDave

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« Reply #20 on: Sep 08, 2017, 12:05PM »

Don't compare the published specs between different manufacturers - they measure in different places. In Schilke terms the Bach 1G is a bit narrower than the 60 and about as deep, with an enormous throat. Way bigger than the 59. Not dissimilar to the Yamaha Yeo, but the Yeo is a much better balanced piece than the 1G.

If the OP likes Schilkes, perhaps it would be a good idea to explore pieces by manufacturers that developed their craft with Schilke. Laskey 85MD and Hammond 20BL seem the obvious two suggestions to me. If those aren't large enough for taste, 90D, 20BXL, 21BL would be logical next steps.
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« Reply #21 on: Sep 08, 2017, 12:50PM »

Why are people suggesting DE 112+++?  The DE 109 is between the Bach 1.25 and Bach 1 (which is just over 110)
Go by Doug's list. Sure the specs on your list might be right... but by feel Doug's list is much closer.

I'd peg the 108 rim to feel slightly larger then a 1 1/2g and his 112 rim is about the same size as a 59 rim.
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« Reply #22 on: Sep 08, 2017, 01:30PM »

The answer is 1 1/2g. Its smaller than 1g but sounds bigger than a 1 1/4g....  ;-)

Leif
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« Reply #23 on: Sep 08, 2017, 01:48PM »

The answer is 1 1/2g. Its smaller than 1g but sounds bigger than a 1 1/4g....  ;-)

Leif

I will have to agree on that one. I'm not a fan of modern Bachs, though.  However, I'm pretty much in love with my GB 1-1/2G. But I digress..
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« Reply #24 on: Sep 08, 2017, 01:53PM »

The answer is 1 1/2g. Its smaller than 1g but sounds bigger than a 1 1/4g....  ;-)

Leif


Maybe for some. I wouldn't count on that for everyone though.
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« Reply #25 on: Sep 08, 2017, 02:44PM »


Maybe for some. I wouldn't count on that for everyone though.

I agree! But we have to try and work with it for some time to know?

I wonder what young bass trombone players like bigbassbone1 and others think;

Is it possible to make a 1 1/2g sound good and work in modern solo, jazz and classical orchestras?

Leif
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Doug Elliott
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« Reply #26 on: Sep 08, 2017, 03:01PM »

Don't compare the published specs between different manufacturers - they measure in different places.

With some manufacturers you can completely ignore their specs... since that's what they do.
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bigbassbone1

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« Reply #27 on: Sep 08, 2017, 03:13PM »

I agree! But we have to try and work with it for some time to know?

I wonder what young bass trombone players like bigbassbone1 and others think;

Is it possible to make a 1 1/2g sound good and work in modern solo, jazz and classical orchestras?

Leif

It's nice to be referred to as young, I haven't heard that for a while  :D

Savio, absolutely I think it's possible. I think that is is possible to make almost any gear work, depending on who the player is.
I have met and heard many players around the world who sound amazing on some really unusual gear, but they tend to be players who are quite well established in how they play, and are looking for a specific quality to their sound.

I think a 1 1/2 is a great size to introduce pretty much everyone to playing the bass trombone. It is manageable for young players and is big/small enough to make any aspect of bass trombone playing possible. For some, that is so they ever need and sound fantastic on it. I learnt from a bass trombone player for many years who pretty much played a 1 1/2G for his entire professional career and he had an awesome sound.

Having said that, in MY experience, I have heard less players that make their best sound on a 1/2 G than I have heard players who do. I find that the danger of someone playing a 1 1/2 G who can't "handle" it (for lack of a better term  :D ) is that they get quite an aggressive sound at higher volumes which can be very difficult to blend with as a tenor or tuba player. I also hear less than more players on 1 1/2's that struggle to sit inside the sound of the tuba when required.

My findings are of course very general. There are dangers that are just as bad when people play mouthpieces that are too big for them also.

The OP is looking specifically for a mouthpiece in SIZE that is between a 1 1/4 And a 1 though. The 1 1/2 is not that.
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« Reply #28 on: Sep 08, 2017, 06:01PM »

The Yeo and the Greg Black 1-1/8G will probably both feel bigger than a Bach 1G.

I would suggest trying other mouthpieces in the size range of the Schilke 59. The Griego GP is a very good one, as are the Laskey 85MD and the Shires 1-1/4MD. I think you'll find they all feel more free-blowing than the 59 and respond more evenly around the range of the instrument. A Doug Elliott in that range can also work well: something like a 112 or 113 rim, J, K or L cup.

I don't recommend either the Greg Black 1-1/4G or the Hammond 20BL, which have very large throats that, to my ear, consistently make the pitch center difficult for players to find. The .312 throat/#2 backbore modification to the Greg Black improves it, I'm sure, but that's still a very deep cup for a rim that size.

Another option is the Ferguson/Kanstul Jeff Reynolds L. It has a wider rim that some players love and some don't, but it's right there between a 59 and 60 size, with a reasonable cup volume, throat and backbore.
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« Reply #29 on: Sep 09, 2017, 04:42AM »

Thanks for all the responses! Just what I need to know  Good!
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« Reply #30 on: Sep 09, 2017, 04:45AM »

(emphasis mine)

The 1G certainly feels large, or at least all of the ones I've played have felt that way to me. The Schilke sizes just feel smaller, even though they might not be. Shape makes a big difference, and I find the Schilke style rims to be more comfortable.  Depending on what works for your physiology, going smaller than a Schilke 59 to a 1 1/4G might actually feel bigger. I know it does for me.  Similarly, you might like a Schilke 60 even though the 1G, nominally the "same size" might feel fine.  Or, naturally, one of Dougs rims on the appropriate cup/shank!

Interesting... I might look into that.
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