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Author Topic: Las Vegas shooting  (Read 4428 times)
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harrison.t.reed
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« Reply #20 on: Oct 02, 2017, 07:59PM »

I figure the layman's definition of automatic would be that if you hold down the trigger it will keep firing bullets until it runs out.

Is that too broad or too narrow?

That's it.
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« Reply #21 on: Oct 02, 2017, 08:42PM »

From the audio, it sounded like it was an AR-15 or other 5.56 NATO fully automatic weapon, or that he simulated full-auto with some kind of Bumpsky stock or a rolled up pair of socks. Might have been an FN Minimi (M249) but I'd be really surprised, not that he had one, but that it took so long to reload.
I'd guess a Stoner (or something else with a similar clacky sound to it), but it didn't sound like an M16 to me at all. Of course it's been 30 years since I used one regularly, and probably 15 since I did much at all with an M15/AR15, and a lot of what I got from the few clip I've seen on the news sounded like rounds striking somewhere fairly near the video camera rather than just rounds leaving the barrel.
 
The guy was apparently a multimillionaire (or just fairly rich), so even the cash required to get a full auto rifle plus the FFL/ea wouldn't have been a problem.
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« Reply #22 on: Oct 02, 2017, 09:31PM »

Whilst you Americans discuss what constitutes an automatic weapon, here is a simple short, succinct article/graph which explains why the rest of the world stares at the USA in disbelief.

http://www.theage.com.au/world/heres-why-australia-will-never-understand-the-us-obsession-with-guns-20171003-gyt7ys.html
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« Reply #23 on: Oct 02, 2017, 10:48PM »

Whilst you Americans discuss what constitutes an automatic weapon, here is a simple short, succinct article/graph which explains why the rest of the world stares at the USA in disbelief.

http://www.theage.com.au/world/heres-why-australia-will-never-understand-the-us-obsession-with-guns-20171003-gyt7ys.html


No fair, making it short and succinct!
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« Reply #24 on: Oct 02, 2017, 11:28PM »

Whilst you Americans discuss what constitutes an automatic weapon, here is a simple short, succinct article/graph which explains why the rest of the world stares at the USA in disbelief.

http://www.theage.com.au/world/heres-why-australia-will-never-understand-the-us-obsession-with-guns-20171003-gyt7ys.html

But I can explain the obsession.

It's the Small Penis Problem. The men who need these guns live in constant, gob-smacking fear that they appear unmanly, that someone thinks them unmanly and that they are unmanly.

They worry that they do not measure up to real men in every parameter... penis, income, career, biceps... acquiring the guns is a way to feed the reassuring fantasy of manly identity, the fantasy that they are some sort of rugged, self-sufficient pioneer.

The fear of inadequate manliness is why they voted Trump over Hillary, why they buy pickup trucks over real cars, and why they play fantasy football instead of an instrument.
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« Reply #25 on: Oct 03, 2017, 01:39AM »

But I can explain the obsession.

It's the Small Penis Problem. The men who need these guns live in constant, gob-smacking fear that they appear unmanly, that someone thinks them unmanly and that they are unmanly.

They worry that they do not measure up to real men in every parameter... penis, income, career, biceps... acquiring the guns is a way to feed the reassuring fantasy of manly identity, the fantasy that they are some sort of rugged, self-sufficient pioneer.

The fear of inadequate manliness is why they voted Trump over Hillary, why they buy pickup trucks over real cars, and why they play fantasy football instead of an instrument.
That’s a broad over-generalization.
You do know Hillary voters have guns too.
And so do women. (XX) women.
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Baron von Bone
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« Reply #26 on: Oct 03, 2017, 05:46AM »

Whilst you Americans discuss what constitutes an automatic weapon, here is a simple short, succinct article/graph which explains why the rest of the world stares at the USA in disbelief.

The "rest of the world" and most liberals stare in disbelief because it satisfies them emotionally to pretend weapons and violence are unfathomable to a top tier predator. That's actually a good thing overall for sure, but it's also the other side of The Deplorables' coin regarding self-awareness and denial.
 
What would be nice, and actually productive, would be if we learned to get out of our own way (first we have to learn it's a thing--a ubiquitous thing in fact) and if people would be honest and learn at least a little about what they're more comfortable fearing and pretending as if it's an incomprehensible boogeyman under the bed. It is a good thing to reassure each other that serious violence is off the menu for the large majority of us (and that this kind of violence is for damn near all of us), but this particular method, while perhaps more emotionally appealing when it's pulled off well, is counterproductive. The combination of denial and willful, even guarded ignorance is never the best way to ensure we're better off. Works no better re: violence for rabid anti-gunners than it does re: sexuality for fundamentalists (see regional domestic abuse and teen pregnancy stats for one indication each of how effective these "strategies" are).
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Baron von Bone
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« Reply #27 on: Oct 03, 2017, 05:47AM »

The fear of inadequate manliness is why they voted Trump over Hillary, why they buy pickup trucks over real cars, and why they play fantasy football instead of an instrument.

Heh ... it would certainly be nice if it were that simple!
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« Reply #28 on: Oct 03, 2017, 07:23AM »

That’s a broad over-generalization.

Broad and general but I'm not convinced it is overly so.
 
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You do know Hillary voters have guns too.
And so do women. (XX) women.

If I told you that some trombones are not Bb trombones would that mean that Bb trombones are rare or imaginary?

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Robert Holmén

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« Reply #29 on: Oct 03, 2017, 07:33AM »


Heh ... it would certainly be nice if it were that simple!

For many it is that simple. That is why you can sell them a pickup truck just by showing one spinning up a cloud of wild west dust while Wilford Brimley tells them it's "Ram Tough."
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« Reply #30 on: Oct 03, 2017, 08:30AM »

A brief description of Paddock:

"a wealthy retiree without strong political or religious convictions or a particular zeal for guns who lived in a quiet Nevada suburb with his girlfriend and made frequent trips to the Las Vegas Strip to play video poker and slots"

For a guy with no particular zeal for guns, he seems to have had quite a few, but otherwise a pretty ordinary man. An accountant, a couple of ex-wives. No word on penis size Rob.

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« Reply #31 on: Oct 03, 2017, 08:40AM »

Motivation? A real head scratcher. The authorities were saying that they hope that he left a note explaining why.

Does he hate crowds? Does he hate C&W music?
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« Reply #32 on: Oct 03, 2017, 09:18AM »

There may not have been any real political, religious, or other reason for this nutjobs shooting up a crowd of innocent people.  Who can guess the motivation of someone sick enough to do something like this?  I'm a former hunter (I just haven't had the time or inclination to go anymore), and I enjoy plinking cans and doing a little target shooting.  I also keep a shotgun handy to defend my home.  All of these activities can be done with weapons with a smaller sized clip, or magazine.  We have to start somewhere with making this kind of mass shooting less lethal. I don't want to take guns away from people (unless they have a known mental defect, or a record as a violent offender), but maybe we could as a nation start will limiting the number of shots that a shooter can get off without reloading, or switching weapons.  At least it would slow down the shooter a little, and give someone an opportunity to act.  I've heard all of the slippery slope arguments that the gun lobbyists keep bringing up, and I'm really not worried that if they limit magazine and clip sizes that the next step is they are going to knock on my door and ask me to give them my shot gun, or my 22 semi-auto, etc.  I realize there are already a lot of these out there, but we have to start somewhere, lets stop producing and selling more.  The only real reason for having a 20 round clip on a gun is to kill a lot of people without reloading, so lets start there.       
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« Reply #33 on: Oct 03, 2017, 09:23AM »

It's hard to rationalize what seems to be a senseless act of madness with what seems to be a degree of planning and premeditation.

 
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Baron von Bone
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« Reply #34 on: Oct 03, 2017, 09:38AM »

For many it is that simple. That is why you can sell them a pickup truck just by showing one spinning up a cloud of wild west dust while Wilford Brimley tells them it's "Ram Tough."

The thing is ... it's when we start thinking we're not so simple as all those other people we disagree with that we set ourselves up for that sort of thing. It's more a matter of what we're trained/socialized to find shiny than a degree of self-possession that makes us immune or even just more resistant to being easily distracted with shiny things.
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« Reply #35 on: Oct 03, 2017, 09:46AM »

A brief description of Paddock:
 
"a wealthy retiree without strong political or religious convictions or a particular zeal for guns who lived in a quiet Nevada suburb with his girlfriend and made frequent trips to the Las Vegas Strip to play video poker and slots"
 
For a guy with no particular zeal for guns, he seems to have had quite a few, but otherwise a pretty ordinary man. An accountant, a couple of ex-wives. No word on penis size Rob.

If it's true that he wasn't all that into them, I guess he saw them just as the tactical tools they are and got no jollies from just having them and all that. It could also be he was really into them, just kept it to himself, but that would be pretty unusual as well.
 
His father was apparently on the FBI's most wanted list for a while when he and his bro were very young--called a psycho bank robber or some such. I gather that meant he produced some human casualties. In any case a number of mental issues are hereditary. That might go a good way toward explaining W.T.F. happened with him.
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« Reply #36 on: Oct 03, 2017, 10:41AM »


If it's true that he wasn't all that into them, I guess he saw them just as the tactical tools they are and got no jollies from just having them and all that. It could also be he was really into them, just kept it to himself, but that would be pretty unusual as well.
 
His father was apparently on the FBI's most wanted list for a while when he and his bro were very young--called a psycho bank robber or some such. I gather that meant he produced some human casualties. In any case a number of mental issues are hereditary. That might go a good way toward explaining W.T.F. happened with him.

50 years ago, though. And, from all accounts, a pretty ordinary guy (the shooter that is) since then. Double life?
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« Reply #37 on: Oct 03, 2017, 10:43AM »

Any chance he played football?  Any history of concussions?

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« Reply #38 on: Oct 03, 2017, 10:53AM »

Have to wonder how much the motivation really matters... I mean, it might help explain "why?!" to people, but prior to an attack there are all types of motivations to do one. The real kicker, practically, is once someone decides to commit such an attack.... how much damage can a single person really pull off? Guns have played a major role. Just compare to some of the attacks in Europe, such as the French train stabbing that killed two people, or the people driving their vehicles into people and then getting out and stabbing in the UK. In contrast, getting a semi-automatic that takes a large number of rounds and going off is much easier and much greater potential of damage.

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« Reply #39 on: Oct 03, 2017, 11:12AM »

For a guy with no particular zeal for guns, he seems to have had quite a few, but otherwise a pretty ordinary man. An accountant, a couple of ex-wives. No word on penis size Rob.
That's a Canadian perspective if I ever heard one.  Since you are Canadian there is a nearly 80% chance you do not own a gun.

I know a fella from Texas, one of the nicest guy's I know, that had a 600 sq. ft. room in his basement that was entirely finished in guns.  Nearly every square inch of the walls had guns on them.  A total of over 1000 rifles and hand guns.  That's what is called a particular zeal for guns in the US.  Not 20 or 30.  That's not even a hobby, just a passing interest.
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