Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length

 
Advanced search

1088974 Posts in 71981 Topics- by 19325 Members - Latest Member: StanKenton69
Jump to:  
The Trombone ForumPractice BreakChit-ChatPurely Politics(Moderators: bhcordova, RedHotMama, BFW) Republican duplicity re: sexual assaults
Pages: 1 2 3 4 [5] 6  All   Go Down
Print
Author Topic: Republican duplicity re: sexual assaults  (Read 2174 times)
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
BGuttman
Mad Chemist

*
*
Offline Offline

Location: Londonderry, NH, USA
Joined: Dec 12, 2000
Posts: 51290
"Almost Professional"


View Profile
« Reply #80 on: Nov 15, 2017, 01:34PM »

Well, it's just a little more than that. People are trying to use the allegations as justification to make Moore drop out of the race, or to have the Senate take him out if he is elected. Opinions are one thing, but taking people out, or punishing them is another thing.

I don't care what your opinion is, but when you call for someone to lose their job per an allegation, then, that's over the top. IMHO.


Well, you had the scaffold built and the rope hung to hang Hillary Clinton over Benghazi when after the investigation completed it turned out that the Republican Congress had withheld money to add to embassy defensive staff, while Clinton herself had nothing to do with the demonstration that became a riot and ended in the deaths of the Ambassador and 3 others.

I also should point out that a lot of the Catholic Priest molestation accusations occurred long after the molestation.  In a lot of cases, the victims blame themselves and suppress the affair.

Note that one accusation against Moore is possibly a fluke.  Five is another matter.
Logged

Bruce Guttman
Solo Trombone, Hollis Town Band
Merrimack Valley Philharmonic Orch. President 2017-2018
robcat2075

*
Offline Offline

Location: Dallas, Texas
Joined: Apr 19, 2009
Posts: 6422

View Profile
« Reply #81 on: Nov 15, 2017, 01:48PM »

We can't allow public discussion of the morality of someone who is running for public office on a morality platform. Not fair!
Logged

Robert Holmén

Hear me as I Play My Horn


Get your Popper, Dotzauer, or Kummer play-alongs!
ddickerson

*
Offline Offline

Location:
Joined: Feb 21, 2009
Posts: 9742

View Profile
« Reply #82 on: Nov 15, 2017, 01:55PM »

Well, you had the scaffold built and the rope hung to hang Hillary Clinton over Benghazi when after the investigation completed it turned out that the Republican Congress had withheld money to add to embassy defensive staff, while Clinton herself had nothing to do with the demonstration that became a riot and ended in the deaths of the Ambassador and 3 others.

I also should point out that a lot of the Catholic Priest molestation accusations occurred long after the molestation.  In a lot of cases, the victims blame themselves and suppress the affair.

Note that one accusation against Moore is possibly a fluke.  Five is another matter.

She lied in public. Video taped.
Logged

Energy City Horizons Symphonic Band
Energy City Big Band
Energy City Dixieland Band
River Pointe Church Praise and Worship Band
slide advantage
*
*
Offline Offline

Location:
Joined: Apr 18, 2016
Posts: 825

View Profile WWW
« Reply #83 on: Nov 15, 2017, 02:28PM »

Well, you had the scaffold built and the rope hung to hang Hillary Clinton over Benghazi when after the investigation completed it turned out that the Republican Congress had withheld money to add to embassy defensive staff, while Clinton herself had nothing to do with the demonstration that became a riot and ended in the deaths of the Ambassador and 3 others.

I also should point out that a lot of the Catholic Priest molestation accusations occurred long after the molestation.  In a lot of cases, the victims blame themselves and suppress the affair.

Note that one accusation against Moore is possibly a fluke.  Five is another matter.

Agreed. DD, it is disingenuous for you to take that stance while you screamed for Hillary to be fired and indicted. Because of the way you take different stands depending on the way the political wind blows you have zero credibility.
Logged
ddickerson

*
Offline Offline

Location:
Joined: Feb 21, 2009
Posts: 9742

View Profile
« Reply #84 on: Nov 15, 2017, 03:05PM »

Agreed. DD, it is disingenuous for you to take that stance while you screamed for Hillary to be fired and indicted. Because of the way you take different stands depending on the way the political wind blows you have zero credibility.

Zero cred goes both ways.
Logged

Energy City Horizons Symphonic Band
Energy City Big Band
Energy City Dixieland Band
River Pointe Church Praise and Worship Band
Ellrod

*
Offline Offline

Location: North
Joined: Oct 30, 2001
Posts: 6399

View Profile
« Reply #85 on: Nov 15, 2017, 03:23PM »

"Republican Senate nominee accused of sexual molestation by five women."

"But what about the Clintons?"

Jeez.
Logged
Baron von Bone
Fear is the Mind-Killer.

*
Offline Offline

Location: Athens, GA (USA)
Joined: Jul 16, 2002
Posts: 18613
"Reality Junkie"


View Profile
« Reply #86 on: Nov 15, 2017, 04:42PM »

"Republican Senate nominee accused of sexual molestation by five women."
 
"But what about the Clintons?"
 
Jeez.

More interested in Us vs. Them than anything functional in terms of ethics/morality.
 
So, yup ... ethically/morally handicapped, basically.
Logged

- Feeding a troll just gives it a platform and amplifies its voice.
 
- Science is what we have learned about how to keep from fooling ourselves.  - Richard Feynman
- He who knows not and knows not that he knows not is a fool.   - Confucius
Stan

*
Offline Offline

Location: Louisville, KY
Joined: Mar 2, 2003
Posts: 587

View Profile
« Reply #87 on: Nov 16, 2017, 03:51AM »

Quote
She lied in public. Video taped.

Trump does that ALL THE TIME.  Jeff Sessions literally did that on Monday.  Where’s your equivalent outrage?  If you don’t get mad at those people, and you do get mad at some lady in a pantsuit, then maybe you need to shut your mouth and contemplate on why you get piled on here every single time you reply. 
Logged
B0B
*
Offline Offline

Location:
Joined: Jun 27, 2008
Posts: 5681

View Profile
« Reply #88 on: Nov 16, 2017, 05:00AM »

Well, it's just a little more than that. People are trying to use the allegations as justification to make Moore drop out of the race, or to have the Senate take him out if he is elected. Opinions are one thing, but taking people out, or punishing them is another thing.

I don't care what your opinion is, but when you call for someone to lose their job per an allegation, then, that's over the top. IMHO.

you mean like chanting "Lock her up! Lock her up!"?

Your hypocrisy is showing, DD.
Logged
B0B
*
Offline Offline

Location:
Joined: Jun 27, 2008
Posts: 5681

View Profile
« Reply #89 on: Nov 16, 2017, 05:32AM »

Zero cred goes both ways.
No, not really. You are failing your own standards. That's just hypocrisy and it only shows on the person doing it.
Logged
ddickerson

*
Offline Offline

Location:
Joined: Feb 21, 2009
Posts: 9742

View Profile
« Reply #90 on: Nov 16, 2017, 05:39AM »

Trump does that ALL THE TIME.  Jeff Sessions literally did that on Monday.  Where’s your equivalent outrage? 

Where was your outrage over Hillary? Were you outraged over Bill Clinton?
Logged

Energy City Horizons Symphonic Band
Energy City Big Band
Energy City Dixieland Band
River Pointe Church Praise and Worship Band
B0B
*
Offline Offline

Location:
Joined: Jun 27, 2008
Posts: 5681

View Profile
« Reply #91 on: Nov 16, 2017, 05:56AM »

Where was your outrage over Hillary? Were you outraged over Bill Clinton?

Always looking to others...

Again, DD, you are failing YOUR OWN standards.

Funny how you want to try to justify your own failings by looking at others. What ever happened to the "personal responsibility" mantra of the party you parrot so often?
Logged
Stan

*
Offline Offline

Location: Louisville, KY
Joined: Mar 2, 2003
Posts: 587

View Profile
« Reply #92 on: Nov 16, 2017, 06:05AM »

Where was your outrage over Hillary? Were you outraged over Bill Clinton?

Didn't vote for either of them!  And now you're just being a crybaby.  Suck it up snowflake!  For an old man, you can be such a baby when the big scary world doesn't jive with the pretty little castle you want to live in.
Logged
sonicsilver
*
Offline Offline

Location:
Joined: Apr 11, 2016
Posts: 508

View Profile
« Reply #93 on: Nov 16, 2017, 06:22AM »


Note that one accusation against Moore is possibly a fluke.  Five is another matter.

I'm surprised Baron von Bone didn't jump on this.

Asserting mutual corroboration from several allegations commits the logical fallacy of begging the question. It assumes the truth of the very proposition to be tested. We haven't yet determined whether each allegation is true, so none can be corroborative of the others.

In recent years there have been several attempts to erode what you Americans call due process, starting with sexual allegations. Campaigns like always believing the woman (what about male victims of rape??), rape shield laws and allowing criminal prosecutions based only on an accusation with no supporting evidence. These erode important and hard-won principles like the presumption of innocence and equality of arms. This has occurred across the Anglophone world, with Canada and England leading the way. Just recently, it seems that the state criminal justice apparatus (police, courts and prisons/probation etc) are now to be bypassed as all too difficult and inconvenient. Much easier to splatter allegations across social media and news media. The examination of the issues is conducted, as Dusty says, in the media and not in a court governed by well-established rules. Punishment is usually in the form of losing job and livelihood, family and friends. This is not the way we deal with criminal behaviour in civilised democracies. The process applied is more akin to the Lynch mob, which I assume you Americans don't want to go back to.

Even more recently, there seems to be a campaign against elected representatives. I grace several countries with my presence on a regular basis and have seen near-identical stories about 'politician perverts.' Many of the claims are really innocuous, hand-on-knee-in-1979 stuff, and not anywhere near the threshold of criminal conduct. But what counts is the damage to reputation, forcing an extra-judicial punishment of resignation and loss of career. The stories are so similar and have come out so close together that I wonder whether there is an element of coordination behind the scenes.

My recommendation to posters on this thread therefore, is to stop squabbling about political partisan sides and et tu quoque. The danger here is that democratic mandates are being undermined by (I can't resist the mixed metaphor) kneejerk fingerpointing which is only scrutinised according to current journalistic standards ie not very well. Beware.
Logged
ddickerson

*
Offline Offline

Location:
Joined: Feb 21, 2009
Posts: 9742

View Profile
« Reply #94 on: Nov 16, 2017, 07:22AM »

Didn't vote for either of them!  And now you're just being a crybaby.  Suck it up snowflake!  For an old man, you can be such a baby when the big scary world doesn't jive with the pretty little castle you want to live in.

You know, I refrain from calling people names just because they have a different beliefs than me. I have many friends that basically believe the same crap you do, and we get along just Fine Business. Why can't you?

For the folks that believe in hypocrisy, consider why the the House and Senate are passing a resolution for sexual harassment training? Seems like a confession for those that are piling on Judge Roy Moore. What about Creepy Uncle Joe Biden (ex-VP)

With all the info about him that's been out there for years, I never saw any outrage of him either.

Oh well, hypocrisy only flows in one direction, according to the leftist liberals.

But, I don't hold that against anyone. LOL!

Logged

Energy City Horizons Symphonic Band
Energy City Big Band
Energy City Dixieland Band
River Pointe Church Praise and Worship Band
Stan

*
Offline Offline

Location: Louisville, KY
Joined: Mar 2, 2003
Posts: 587

View Profile
« Reply #95 on: Nov 16, 2017, 07:25AM »

@sonicsilver

On the other hand, without qualifying evidence to the contrary, should victims not be taken at their word in the court of public opinion?  

What's happening in this election, in particular, is an individual of already questionable ethical behavior, who has a documented history of questionable behavior, being accused as part of a larger societal awakening that
Quote
it's ok
for victims to come forward.  Roy Moore's reputation was already tarnished well before any of this happened.  When confronted with those facts, his supporters doubled down on denial, blamed the women, and created a firestorm that's burning them alive.

The basic point that "accusal is all it takes" to ruin someone is well taken, but the opposite is equally true:  Victims that cannot feel safe to go public are ruined.  

The basic reputations of the accused are also extremely relevant here.  Roy Moore went into this with printed reports of abuse a decades ago.  He went into it having defied the Supreme Court, and having been removed from the bench.  His integrity was absolutely questionable, and it's worth having that conversation at election time.  It's also troubling to many that he hides himself behind a cloak of religion while acting in ways which undermine that position.

For the opposite, let's see what happens with George Takei.  He's had a spotless reputation for decades, and there's been resistance to blindly accept his sole accuser.  

If someone has spent decades in the public sphere ruining their own reputation, it shouldn't be surprising that public opinion sours on them when multiple people make accusations.
Logged
Stan

*
Offline Offline

Location: Louisville, KY
Joined: Mar 2, 2003
Posts: 587

View Profile
« Reply #96 on: Nov 16, 2017, 07:29AM »

You know, I refrain from calling people names just because they have a different beliefs than me. I have many friends that basically believe the same crap you do, and we get along just Fine Business. Why can't you?

For the folks that believe in hypocrisy, consider why the the House and Senate are passing a resolution for sexual harassment training? Seems like a confession for those that are piling on Judge Roy Moore. What about Creepy Uncle Joe Biden (ex-VP)

With all the info about him that's been out there for years, I never saw any outrage of him either.

Oh well, hypocrisy only flows in one direction, according to the leftist liberals.

But, I don't hold that against anyone. LOL!





Waaaaaaaaaaaaa!

You don't know what I believe, snowflake!  But I'll spell it out for ya!  People like you give actual conservatives a bad name. 
Logged
B0B
*
Offline Offline

Location:
Joined: Jun 27, 2008
Posts: 5681

View Profile
« Reply #97 on: Nov 16, 2017, 08:08AM »

You know, I refrain from calling people names just because they have a different beliefs than me. I have many friends that basically believe the same crap you do, and we get along just Fine Business. Why can't you?

For the folks that believe in hypocrisy, consider why the the House and Senate are passing a resolution for sexual harassment training? Seems like a confession for those that are piling on Judge Roy Moore. What about Creepy Uncle Joe Biden (ex-VP)

With all the info about him that's been out there for years, I never saw any outrage of him either.

Oh well, hypocrisy only flows in one direction, according to the leftist liberals.

But, I don't hold that against anyone. LOL!

Again, hypocrisy is about a person and their own standards. Not others. Have evangelicals and the conservative right lost their morals and ethics so much that they have none of their own to look at or uphold?
Logged
ddickerson

*
Offline Offline

Location:
Joined: Feb 21, 2009
Posts: 9742

View Profile
« Reply #98 on: Nov 16, 2017, 08:12AM »



Waaaaaaaaaaaaa!

You don't know what I believe, snowflake!  But I'll spell it out for ya!  People like you give actual conservatives a bad name. 

There you go again. Just can't help it, can you?
Logged

Energy City Horizons Symphonic Band
Energy City Big Band
Energy City Dixieland Band
River Pointe Church Praise and Worship Band
B0B
*
Offline Offline

Location:
Joined: Jun 27, 2008
Posts: 5681

View Profile
« Reply #99 on: Nov 16, 2017, 08:13AM »

There you go again. Just can't help it, can you?
You could easily be saying that to a mirror, DD.
Logged
Pages: 1 2 3 4 [5] 6  All   Go Up
Print
Jump to: