Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length

 
Advanced search

1088801 Posts in 71963 Topics- by 19320 Members - Latest Member: louise.sebene
Jump to:  
The Trombone ForumTeaching & LearningBeginners and Returning Trombonists(Moderator: bhcordova) Practice mute or mouthpiece buzzing plus other things?
Pages: 1 [2]  All   Go Down
Print
Author Topic: Practice mute or mouthpiece buzzing plus other things?  (Read 1315 times)
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
bonesmarsh
*
Offline Offline

Location:
Joined: May 22, 2007
Posts: 2221

View Profile
« Reply #20 on: Dec 05, 2017, 12:07PM »

A bit off topic-- when asked about a small point of warming up in a masterclass, CSO tubist Arnold Jacobs admitted that he played and taught so much he was never cold. He was always warmed up.

Probably the same with Cat Anderson. Mere mortals can READ about exercises, but until you've lived in Cat Anderson's chops and been on the bus for 25 years it is a different matter.

Try mutes and buzzing. The important thing is that you're blowing air, and staying in shape. Better to think about buzzing and mutes while using those methods, than take a day off, if you're concerned about the physical part of your playing.

As for Cat Anderson? His personal mouthpiece has been described as: " a dime, with a hole drilled in it." Take that into consideration as well.
Logged
Pre59

*
Offline Offline

Location: Devon UK
Joined: May 26, 2015
Posts: 596

View Profile
« Reply #21 on: Dec 05, 2017, 01:51PM »


Try mutes and buzzing. The important thing is that you're blowing air, and staying in shape. Better to think about buzzing and mutes while using those methods, than take a day off, if you're concerned about the physical part of your playing.


+1

Buzzing and mutes are all good IMO..
Logged

In my reality..
peteriley
*
Offline Offline

Location:
Joined: Aug 26, 2016
Posts: 76

View Profile
« Reply #22 on: Dec 05, 2017, 02:52PM »

1. If your aperture wants to be to the side, there's at least a possibility that you shouldn't fight it, let it be there.  Not everybody should play "centered.". I certainly don't.
2. I can't say for sure without seeing it, but that sounds like a good thing.
3. Yes it's challenging and good for you.
4. I probably wouldn't use this kind of playing for articulation exercise, and "strength building for the tongue" may not be a good thing.
5. Yes, one of the reasons I don't like to  practice with any mute.

Hi Doug,

Thanks for the comments - make sense.

Pete
Logged
afugate

*
Offline Offline

Location: Oklahoma City, OK
Joined: Mar 24, 2013
Posts: 470

View Profile
« Reply #23 on: Dec 05, 2017, 07:34PM »

But realize I've actually worked with Andy directly, both by Skype and in person.

 Good!  Yes, and the exercises without the understanding that goes with them would be pointless.  And likely only specific to my particular shortcomings.

Probably time for another lesson... :)

--Andy
Logged

I'm an optimist.  Some day, I'll sound like Bill Watrous.  And, I'm still waiting on that darned growth spurt!
blast

*
*
Offline Offline

Location: scotland
Joined: Jul 26, 2001
Posts: 6995
"Bass/Contrabass trombone, Scottish Opera."


View Profile
« Reply #24 on: Dec 06, 2017, 12:54AM »

The practice mute is less than ideal but playing 105% of a trombone is a lot better than playing with only 5% of your instrument.

That one I strongly disagree with. Practice mutes can destabilise playing far more easily than mouthpiece buzzing.  It would take too long to go into the reasons but it is what I have seen over many years.

Chris Stearn
Logged

Still cannot think of anything better to do. Back on an old 1 1/2G again !
peteriley
*
Offline Offline

Location:
Joined: Aug 26, 2016
Posts: 76

View Profile
« Reply #25 on: Dec 06, 2017, 06:15AM »

That one I strongly disagree with. Practice mutes can destabilise playing far more easily than mouthpiece buzzing.  It would take too long to go into the reasons but it is what I have seen over many years.

Chris Stearn

Hi Chris,

Is that because of the significant additional back-pressure that the plugging up of the bell produces? In that case, going to the other extreme of having none would also be bad, but not as much. But are there advantages of buzzing on the mouthpiece that make it superior to always playing on the trombone (at least for a little bit)? Or, if you can always have your trombone, that's always the best option. The reason I ask is that if the correct back-pressure is a key issue, then using a Warburton plug at the end of the mouthpiece would seem to be the best all around compromise.

(I've been on travel for a week (with another two weeks to go) with my trombone, a spare kelly MP, and a practice mute, and I've been limited in being able to play at full volume. So I'm looking for "best practices" for having productive practice sessions". I have noticed that my lip flexibilities are getting worse from just using the practice mute, so I've started playing super quiet as suggested by Doug).

Cheers, Pete
Logged
Pre59

*
Offline Offline

Location: Devon UK
Joined: May 26, 2015
Posts: 596

View Profile
« Reply #26 on: Dec 06, 2017, 09:58AM »


then using a Warburton plug at the end of the mouthpiece would seem to be the best all around compromise.


Do you mean a Warburton Buzzard?
Logged

In my reality..
blast

*
*
Offline Offline

Location: scotland
Joined: Jul 26, 2001
Posts: 6995
"Bass/Contrabass trombone, Scottish Opera."


View Profile
« Reply #27 on: Dec 07, 2017, 12:25AM »

Hi Chris,

Is that because of the significant additional back-pressure that the plugging up of the bell produces? In that case, going to the other extreme of having none would also be bad, but not as much. But are there advantages of buzzing on the mouthpiece that make it superior to always playing on the trombone (at least for a little bit)? Or, if you can always have your trombone, that's always the best option. The reason I ask is that if the correct back-pressure is a key issue, then using a Warburton plug at the end of the mouthpiece would seem to be the best all around compromise.

(I've been on travel for a week (with another two weeks to go) with my trombone, a spare kelly MP, and a practice mute, and I've been limited in being able to play at full volume. So I'm looking for "best practices" for having productive practice sessions". I have noticed that my lip flexibilities are getting worse from just using the practice mute, so I've started playing super quiet as suggested by Doug).

Cheers, Pete

It's to do with the way the brain works. It sees a trombone with a mute as a trombone but a mouthpiece alone is viewed as something very different. Previous trombone learning can be damaged by extended mute work which can be mentally overlaid with the change in resistance.  Mouthpiece buzzing is mentally treated as a unique action though there will be spillover into normal playing with extended use. The spillover is usually beneficial.
It is far mor complex but that is a rough idea.

Chris Stearn
Logged

Still cannot think of anything better to do. Back on an old 1 1/2G again !
Pre59

*
Offline Offline

Location: Devon UK
Joined: May 26, 2015
Posts: 596

View Profile
« Reply #28 on: Dec 07, 2017, 03:29AM »

I've been using these things for so long now it's become as normal as changing shoes. I made a choice to live somewhere where I can't play open, but with other benefits. So what started as a compromise has given me some gains, and even if I were to live somewhere where I could practice open, I would still use them.






(But not the DW practice mute though..)
Logged

In my reality..
Dixieland57
*
Offline Offline

Location:
Joined: Apr 1, 2014
Posts: 312

View Profile
« Reply #29 on: Dec 07, 2017, 07:16AM »

I've buy a Maslet mute and it's even better than the Bremner!
Logged
Pre59

*
Offline Offline

Location: Devon UK
Joined: May 26, 2015
Posts: 596

View Profile
« Reply #30 on: Dec 07, 2017, 12:26PM »

I've buy a Maslet mute and it's even better than the Bremner!

That's been my experience as well.
Logged

In my reality..
peteriley
*
Offline Offline

Location:
Joined: Aug 26, 2016
Posts: 76

View Profile
« Reply #31 on: Dec 07, 2017, 02:29PM »

It's to do with the way the brain works. It sees a trombone with a mute as a trombone but a mouthpiece alone is viewed as something very different. Previous trombone learning can be damaged by extended mute work which can be mentally overlaid with the change in resistance.  Mouthpiece buzzing is mentally treated as a unique action though there will be spillover into normal playing with extended use. The spillover is usually beneficial.
It is far mor complex but that is a rough idea.

Chris Stearn

Hi Chris,

Thanks that makes sense.

Pete
Logged
Pages: 1 [2]  All   Go Up
Print
Jump to: