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Author Topic: Getting a red brass bell  (Read 1507 times)
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Horn Builder

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« Reply #20 on: Jan 11, 2018, 02:01PM »

A point of clarification.

Yes, the Bach 50 bells are all spun on the same mandrel, but it is NOT "the same amount of metal, just spread out to the extra flare". Both bell sizes start out at the same thickness and the same shape blank, and they are simply trimmed to a different diameter at the end of the forming.

FWIW...
M
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Matthew Walker
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Terraplane8Bob
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« Reply #21 on: Jan 11, 2018, 03:51PM »

The King 8B that I mentioned earlier was ordered with a "Gold Brass" bell.  Far from being a "tubby" horn I found it to be overly bright and could easily get out of hand at louder dynamics.  To improve that characteristic I had my tech install a removable bell brace.  My tech, Wayne Baughman,[also a trumpeter by trade] reasoned that trumpets had a bell brace about a third of the way from the end of the bell and that a trombone should have had one also except for the fact that it would be impossible to separate the bell and slide for storage if that brace was soldered in place.  Therefore, he made the brace removable using his own clever design.   I had posted pictures of this unique solution in other posts on the forum, but I suppose, like so many other helpful photos, they have disappeared into the ether. I alternated the 8B with my beloved Duo Gravis for at least 20 years of my playing career. I still find it to be a great horn with a wonderful sound.  Others may disagree -----------.   Cheers !!  Bob
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mr.deacon
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« Reply #22 on: Jan 11, 2018, 05:08PM »

A point of clarification.

Yes, the Bach 50 bells are all spun on the same mandrel, but it is NOT "the same amount of metal, just spread out to the extra flare". Both bell sizes start out at the same thickness and the same shape blank, and they are simply trimmed to a different diameter at the end of the forming.

FWIW...
M
Then why are the 50BL bells always so thin?

If they are made the way you said they are then they would be the same exact thickness as a regular 50B bell, which in many of our experiences... is not the case.
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Burgerbob

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« Reply #23 on: Jan 11, 2018, 05:17PM »

A point of clarification.

Yes, the Bach 50 bells are all spun on the same mandrel, but it is NOT "the same amount of metal, just spread out to the extra flare". Both bell sizes start out at the same thickness and the same shape blank, and they are simply trimmed to a different diameter at the end of the forming.

FWIW...
M

Has that changed over time? All the post-Corp bells up until the '00s I've seen were very thin. I did have a teacher with a very heavy gauge gold L (but not H) bell, so they do exist.
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elmsandr

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« Reply #24 on: Jan 11, 2018, 07:34PM »

Then why are the 50BL bells always so thin?

If they are made the way you said they are then they would be the same exact thickness as a regular 50B bell, which in many of our experiences... is not the case.
The metal gets thinner as you spread out in diameter the way Bach forms their bells. If you trimmed it back an inch, it would be extremely similar/within normal variation near the (new) rim.

Cheers,
Andy
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Andrew Elms
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« Reply #25 on: Jan 12, 2018, 03:03AM »

8Bob,
I remember seeing those photos of your brace- I wish I had tried that solution back in the day. I do think that with a little more development the 8B could've been a really great horn out of the box. Unfortunately the 50BL has ruined the reputation of large bell bassbones. The 8B really does have a wonderful sound. I've only ever met a handful of people who played one, Bob Higgins comes to mind- I don't know if he still plays it but when I knew him in the late 80's he was playing one & sounded like a god. He had a Benge 290 leadpipe fitted to it, and after hearing him play like that I immediately went to Chuck Ward & had him put one in mine. That definitely made the difference- tamed the brightness in the loud dynamics as you mentioned.
I bought my 8B second hand from a small music store in Bowling Green OH owned by the parents of the late Lamar Jones after he had passed. I think it still had some of his magic in it.
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Full Pedal Trombonist

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« Reply #26 on: Jan 12, 2018, 09:23AM »

I only read the first several replies, but if no one mentioned it a Holton bell is pretty fun on a Bach chassis. I have a 280 bell on a mostly Bach bell section and I love it.
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MontyPython
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« Reply #27 on: Jan 12, 2018, 05:38PM »

The metal gets thinner as you spread out in diameter the way Bach forms their bells. If you trimmed it back an inch, it would be extremely similar/within normal variation near the (new) rim.

Cheers,
Andy

My 50b3LO is a thin gauge for sure.  The stock case put the bell at an angle, and if the case gets dropped on it's end the weight of the upper section will crease your bell.
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MontyPython
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« Reply #28 on: Jan 12, 2018, 05:47PM »

I only read the first several replies, but if no one mentioned it a Holton bell is pretty fun on a Bach chassis. I have a 280 bell on a mostly Bach bell section and I love it.
 

Does a person have to be lucky to find holton bells, or did you just find a holton bone and strip it?
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elmsandr

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« Reply #29 on: Jan 12, 2018, 06:07PM »

 

Does a person have to be lucky to find holton bells, or did you just find a holton bone and strip it?
A few years ago there was a cache of 280 bells (screw bells) that were available on eBay.

I was also lucky to get one, as was Blast.  It is a fun bell, but I still need to get a case to take advantage it.

Cheers,
Andy
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Andrew Elms
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« Reply #30 on: Jan 12, 2018, 11:43PM »

A few years ago there was a cache of 280 bells (screw bells) that were available on eBay.

I was also lucky to get one, as was Blast.  It is a fun bell, but I still need to get a case to take advantage it.

Cheers,
Andy

I went down to Big 5 sporting goods and got a double rifle case on clearance. I posted about it, and it works great if you need slim transport over heavy protection.

I got that bass here on the Forum and I would love to be able to put an old 9.5 Holton bell on for a try, but I hate the thought of one of those beauties needing to be taken apart. Though I would think any good technician could reassemble it no sweat.

Anyway my personal advice would be to try to trade for a different horn if you feel you need something different.
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