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BGuttman
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« Reply #80 on: Sep 06, 2008, 07:54PM »

...

The more I read about copyright, the more confused I become.


This is what keeps Intellectual Property Lawyers in business. ;-)
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Bruce Guttman
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« Reply #81 on: Aug 24, 2011, 04:13PM »

have fun reading

or you could pay an attorney specializing in copyright law, I guess.


http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/bill-would-help-combat-copyright-offenders-on-the-internet/2011/08/23/gIQA3SYdbJ_story.html

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Editorial Board Opinion

Bill would help combat copyright offenders on the Internet

The Protect IP (Intellectual Property) Act, introduced by Sen. Patrick J. Leahy (D-Vt.) and a bipartisan group of lawmakers, would give the government and copyright- and trademark-holders a means to combat this problem. Rep. Lamar Smith (R-Tex.) is expected to introduce a House version once Congress returns next month.

The proposal would allow the Justice Department or a private rights holder to move against a rogue foreign Web site by convincing a federal judge that the site is “dedicated to” and has “no significant use” other than copyright or trademark infringement. Defendant Web sites would have the right to contest the allegation. An otherwise legitimate site that may have sold a product that turned out to be a fake or unknowingly linked to or posted an item to which it did not have the rights would be spared legal action. . . .

Some U.S. Internet businesses and open Internet advocates worry that the Protect IP Act could choke off legitimate speech by authorizing the demise of entire Web sites, rather than specific content. They point to the effectiveness of the Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DMCA), which requires Web site owners to take down individual pieces of pirated content after a copyright holder complains. But what if the Web site is a consistent scofflaw? . . .

here is the text of the proposed bill:

http://leahy.senate.gov/imo/media/doc/BillText-PROTECTIPAct.pdf


 Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DMCA)
http://www.copyright.gov/legislation/hr2281.pdf
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Allen
First and foremost I'm a proud Dad & lucky Husband.  They say great minds can differ (not that I claim to have a great mind).  Remember that $ and my opinion buys coffee at the diner.
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« Reply #82 on: Jan 15, 2012, 04:48AM »

update on efforts to redo the proposed law

looks like a start over

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/15/us/white-house-says-it-opposes-parts-of-2-antipiracy-bills.html?ref=us

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The Obama administration said Saturday that it strongly opposed central elements of two Congressional efforts to enforce copyrights on the Internet, all but killing the current versions of legislation that has divided both political parties and pitted Hollywood against Silicon Valley. 

The comments by the administration’s chief technology officials, posted on a White House blog Saturday,

http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/2012/01/14/obama-administration-responds-we-people-petitions-sopa-and-online-piracy

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The White House has responded to two petitions about legislative approaches to combat online piracy. In their response, Victoria Espinel, Intellectual Property Enforcement Coordinator at Office of Management and Budget, Aneesh Chopra, U.S. Chief Technology Officer, and Howard Schmidt, Special Assistant to the President and Cybersecurity Coordinator for National Security Staff stress that the important task of protecting intellectual property online must not threaten an open and innovative internet. . . .

more from the NY Times:

Quote
came as growing opposition to the legislation had already led sponsors of the bills to reconsider a measure that would force Internet service providers to block access to Web sites that offer or link to copyrighted material.

“Let us be clear,” the White House statement said, “online piracy is a real problem that harms the American economy, threatens jobs for significant numbers of middle class workers and hurts some of our nation’s most creative and innovative companies and entrepreneurs.”

However, it added, “We will not support legislation that reduces freedom of expression, increases cybersecurity risk or undermines the dynamic, innovative global Internet.”

The bills currently under consideration in Congress were intended to combat the theft of copyrighted materials by preventing American search engines like Google and Yahoo from directing users to sites that allow for the distribution of stolen materials. They would cut off payment processors like PayPal that handle transactions.

The bills would also allow private citizens and companies to sue to stop what they believed to be theft of protected content. Those and other provisions set off fierce opposition among Internet companies, technology investors and free speech advocates, who said the bills would stifle online innovation, violate the First Amendment and even compromise national security by undermining the integrity of the Internet’s naming system.

Though the Obama administration called for legislation this year that would give prosecutors and owners of intellectual property new abilities to deter overseas piracy, it also embraced the idea of “voluntary measures and best practices” to reduce piracy. . . .
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Allen
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BGuttman
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« Reply #83 on: Jan 15, 2012, 05:59AM »

The problem with online copyrights is that we have a problem and the folks trying to "fix" the problem are going after the wrong people.  It sorta reminds me of the approach to election fraud: we have problems with election fraud so we attack one small (possibly insignificant) part of it: certifying voters.

The 600 pound gorilla in the room are the counterfeiters.  These guys have no compunction of making thousands of copies of digital media and selling it at a lower price; the profits go entirely to the counterfeiters, most of whom are not in the US and hence out of reach of law enforcement.

There is a 400 pound gorilla as well.  It is the file share sites.  These are now also not in the US and hence beyond the reach of the law.

So now we have the people who are being aggrieved going after the one thing they can.  We have some copyrighted material being put on YouTube, Wikipedia, and other such sites.  And these people are not happy to just have the material removed; they want to take down the sites entirely.  This is misguided.  YouTube has removed copyrighted material when requested.  This should be sufficient.  Same goes for other ethical sites.  This is what upsets the "Free Internet" folks.

I don't know the solution to the counterfeits.  We have a similar problem in Electronics, but with more serious consequences: many counterfeit parts don't work as well as the real ones (if they work at all) and this can be a serious problem with things like medical equipment and armaments.  As long as there are amoral people there will be counterfeits.  There probably should be an international agreement that is enforced (the Chinese have anti-counterfeit laws but the stuff coming out of there indicates that they don't enforce them).
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Bruce Guttman
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« Reply #84 on: Jan 18, 2012, 03:46AM »

http://money.cnn.com/2012/01/17/technology/sopa_explained/index.htm?iid=Lead


Quote
SOPA explained: What it is and why it matters

 . . . What is SOPA? SOPA is an acronym for the Stop Online Piracy Act. It's a proposed bill that aims to crack down on copyright infringement by restricting access to sites that host pirated content.

SOPA's main targets are "rogue" overseas sites like torrent hub The Pirate Bay, which are a trove for illegal downloads of movies and other digital content.

Content creators have battled against piracy for years -- remember Napster? -- but it's hard for U.S. companies to take action against foreign sites. So SOPA's goal is to cut off pirate sites' oxygen by requiring U.S. search engines, advertising networks and other providers to withhold their services.

That means sites like Google wouldn't show flagged sites in their search results, and payment processors like eBay's (EBAY, Fortune 500) PayPal couldn't transmit funds to them.

Both sides say they agree that protecting content is a worthy goal. But opponents say that the way SOPA is written effectively promotes censorship and is rife with the potential for unintended consequences.

Silicon Valley woke up and took notice of the implications when SOPA was introduced in the House of Representatives in October. But its very similar counterpart, PIPA, flew under the radar and was approved by a Senate committee in May. PIPA is now pending before the full Senate and scheduled for a vote on January 24, though some senators are pushing for a delay.

Isn't copyright infringement already illegal? Yes. The 1998 Digital Millennium Copyright Act lays out enforcement measures. . . .
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Allen
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BGuttman
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« Reply #85 on: Jan 18, 2012, 05:59AM »

This seems to be getting more and more like the "fight" against pornography or the "war" on drugs.

These things would dry up and blow away in the wind if the demand was not there.

Why do people want to use these sites?  Because they perceive that the prices for the legitimate items are excessive.  If the legitimate cost for something was perceived to be correct most people would gladly pay the tariff and be done with it.

It might be that some products don't properly explain why their prices are what they are.

But when we have folks like Bill Gates amassing huge fortunes because the OS or the Office apps go for between $200 and $500 a copy, the perception is that we are paying for a lot more than his real costs.  Hence people go to pirate sites to avoid what they perceive as excessive profit taking.

There aren't too many people in this thing whose hands are really clean.
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Bruce Guttman
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« Reply #86 on: Jan 18, 2012, 08:01PM »

http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2012/01/scotus-re-copyright-decision/
Wow....
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« Reply #87 on: Jan 18, 2012, 08:19PM »

Nothing new here.  There is an International Copyright that is much more comprehensive than the US copyright and the Supremes are simply saying that we should adhere to the foreign model.

We had another time just before Congress passed the first Disney Relief Act (copyright extension) where a number of works from the 1920s and 1930s suddenly had passed their 56 year limit and reverted to Public Domain.  Then they reverted to copyright because of the first extension.  We have a couple of works in our library that we got during that "magic" period that if we lost we could never recover (they will probably remain under copyright as long as Walt Disney Enterprises remains in business).
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Bruce Guttman
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« Reply #88 on: Jan 19, 2012, 01:30AM »


here is the link to the text of most recent USSC decision on copyright issues which is referred to by HBT:

http://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/11pdf/10-545.pdf

Golan v. Holder

Quote
. . . Petitioners are orchestra conductors, musicians, publishers, and others who formerly enjoyed free access to works §514 removed from the public domain. They maintain that Congress, in passing §514,exceeded its authority under the Copyright Clause and transgressed First Amendment limitations.

The District Court granted the Attorney General’s motion for summary judgment. Affirming in part, theTenth Circuit agreed that Congress had not offended the Copyright Clause, but concluded that §514 required further First Amendmentinspection in light of Eldred v. Ashcroft, 537 U. S. 186.

On remand, the District Court granted summary judgment to petitioners on the First Amendment claim, holding that §514’s constriction of the publicd omain was not justified by any of the asserted federal interests.

The Tenth Circuit reversed, ruling that §514 was narrowly tailored to fitthe important government aim of protecting U. S. copyright holders’ interests abroad.

Held:

1. Section 514 does not exceed Congress’ authority under the Copyright Clause. Pp. 13–23.
(a) The text of the Copyright Clause does not exclude applicationof copyright protection to works in the public domain. Eldred is largely dispositive of petitioners’ claim that the Clause’s confinementof a copyright’s lifespan to a “limited Tim[e]” prevents the removal ofworks from the public domain. In Eldred, the Court upheld the Copyright Term Extension Act (CTEA), which extended, by 20 years, the terms of existing copyrights. The text of the Copyright Clause, theCourt observed, contains no “command that a time prescription, onceset, becomes forever ‘fixed’ or ‘inalterable,’ ” and the Court declined to infer any such command. 537 U. S., at 199. The construction petitioners tender here is similarly infirm. The terms afforded works restored by §514 are no less “limited” than those the CTEA lengthened. Nor had the “limited Tim[e]” already passed for the works at issuehere—many of them works formerly denied any U. S. copyright protection—for a period of exclusivity must begin before it may end. Petitioners also urge that the Government’s position would allow Congress to legislate perpetual copyright terms by instituting successive“limited” terms as prior terms expire. But as in Eldred, such hypothetical misbehavior is far afield from this case. In aligning theUnited States with other nations bound by Berne, Congress can hardly be charged with a design to move stealthily toward a perpetual copyright regime. Pp. 13–15.

(b)
Historical practice corroborates the Court’s reading of the Copyright Clause to permit the protection of previously unprotectedworks. In the Copyright Act of 1790, the First Congress protectedworks that had been freely reproducible under State copyright laws.Subsequent actions confirm that Congress has not understood the Copyright Clause to preclude protection for existing works. Several private bills restored the copyrights and patents of works and inventions previously in the public domain. Congress has also passed generally applicable legislation granting copyrights and patents to works and inventions that had lost protection. Pp. 15–19.
(c)
Petitioners also argue that §514 fails to “promote the Progress of Science” as contemplated by the initial words of the Copyright Clause. Specifically, they claim that because §514 affects only works already created, it cannot meet the Clause’s objective. The creation of new works, however, is not the sole way Congress may promote“Science,” i.e., knowledge and learning. In Eldred, this Court rejecteda nearly identical argument, concluding that the Clause does not demand that each copyright provision, examined discretely, operate toinduce new works. Rather the Clause “empowers Congress to determine the intellectual property regimes that, overall, in that body’s judgment, will serve the ends of the Clause.” 537 U. S., at 222. Nothing in the text or history of the Copyright Clause, moreover, confines the “Progress of Science” exclusively to “incentives for creation.” Historical evidence, congressional practice, and this Court’s decisions, in fact, suggest that inducing the dissemination of existingworks is an appropriate means to promote science. Pp. 20–22.
(d)
Considered against this backdrop, §514 falls comfortably within Congress’ Copyright Clause authority. Congress had reason to believe that a well-functioning international copyright system would encourage the dissemination of existing and future works. And testimony informed Congress that full compliance with Berne would expand the foreign markets available to U. S. authors and invigorate protection against piracy of U. S. works abroad, thus benefitting copyright-intensive industries stateside and inducing greater investment in the creative process. This Court has no warrant to reject Congress’ rational judgment that exemplary adherence to Berne would serve the objectives of the Copyright Clause. Pp. 22–23.
2. The First Amendment does not inhibit the restoration author
(a)
The pathmarking Eldred decision is again instructive. There, the Court held that the CTEA’s enlargement of a copyright’s duration did not offend the First Amendment’s freedom of expression guarantee. Recognizing that some restriction on expression is the inherent and intended effect of every grant of copyright, the Court observed that the Framers regarded copyright protection not simply as a limiton the manner in which expressive works may be used, but also as an“engine of free expression.” 537 U. S., at 219. The “traditional contours” of copyright protection, i.e., the “idea/expression dichotomy” and the “fair use” defense, moreover, serve as “built-in First Amendment accommodations.” Ibid. Given the speech-protective purposes and safeguards embraced by copyright law, there was no call for theheightened review sought in Eldred. The Court reaches the same conclusion here. Section 514 leaves undisturbed the idea/expressiondistinction and the fair use defense. Moreover, Congress adoptedmeasures to ease the transition from a national scheme to an international copyright regime. Pp. 23–26.
(b)
Petitioners claim that First Amendment interests of a higherorder are at stake because they—unlike their Eldred counterparts—enjoyed “vested rights” in works that had already entered the publicdomain. Their contentions depend on an argument already considered and rejected, namely, that the Constitution renders the public domain largely untouchable by Congress. Nothing in the historicalrecord, subsequent congressional practice, or this Court’s jurisprudence warrants exceptional First Amendment solicitude for copyrighted works that were once in the public domain. Congress has several times adjusted copyright law to protect new categories ofworks as well as works previously in the public domain. Section 514, moreover, does not impose a blanket prohibition on public access.The question is whether would-be users of certain foreign works mustpay for their desired use of the author’s expression, or else limit their exploitation to “fair use” of those works. By fully implementingBerne, Congress ensured that these works, like domestic and mostother foreign works, would be governed by the same legal regime. Section 514 simply placed foreign works in the position they would have occupied if the current copyright regime had been in effect whenthose works were created and first published. Pp. 26–30.
609 F. 3d 1076, affirmed. . . .
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Allen
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« Reply #89 on: May 13, 2015, 06:50AM »

I am an adjunct professor of music at Fairfield University...I am happy to answer any questions regarding Copyright at any time.  I have over ten (10) years of experience in music publishing and licensing.

Happy to help!
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« Reply #90 on: May 13, 2015, 06:57AM »

I am an adjunct professor of music at Fairfield University...I am happy to answer any questions regarding Copyright at any time.  I have over ten (10) years of experience in music publishing and licensing.

Happy to help!

If I purchase a play-along song book from MMO or any other source and record myself with their cd accompaniment, can I publish it on YouTube and perform it in public - giving the source due credit - and do so with impunity if I do not take any money for said performance?

...Geezer
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« Reply #91 on: May 13, 2015, 09:27AM »

If I purchase a play-along song book from MMO or any other source and record myself with their cd accompaniment, can I publish it on YouTube and perform it in public - giving the source due credit - and do so with impunity if I do not take any money for said performance?

...Geezer

In a word, No.  By purchasing the product you have satisfied your legal obligation, through the parent company, to own a copy of the folio/ sheet music in exchange for paying a license fee (the cost of the book).  In order to take someone else's sound recording, the cd, and use that in a video that you produced embedding that sound into your video is only permitted and accomplished by executing a synchronization license with the publisher and master use license with the owner of the soundrecording simultaneously. If you were to re record the accompanying music in your own way and use that, then you would in fact be the owner of that specific sound recording, however, you would still have to execute a mechanical license to re record the original accompaniment you were recording...in any sense, you have to license the right to use other people's copyright in your own endeavors. This doesn't always mean you have to pay because sometimes writers and publishers give gratis licenses (dependent on several factors), however, the licensing process always has to occur, even in the minimal sense of the process.
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« Reply #92 on: May 13, 2015, 09:28AM »

Question: what was the basis for "Peter and the Wolf" being considered PD at all?




If I purchase a play-along song book from MMO or any other source and record myself with their cd accompaniment, can I publish it on YouTube and perform it in public - giving the source due credit - and do so with impunity if I do not take any money for said performance?

I expect the answer to that would be "no". MMO owns the copyright to that recording and hasn't given permission for you to make copies of it, overdubbed or not. Credit-giving and/or finances don't alter that test.
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« Reply #93 on: May 13, 2015, 09:52AM »

Was that a question for me? I am sorry I am new here- just trying to get a feel for the forum/ posting etiquette lol.

Copyright varies in country to country...here in the US we have renewal options that extend the life of copyright sometimes exceptionally longer than in other countries...Canada gives copyright less of a timeline...Asian countries also have a 'writer's life + 50 years' policy in place.

If a song is written after 1922, especially here in the US, there is a very good chance that the composition is still protected under the copyright act of 1976 and not public domain.  The best pursuit whenever looking to cover a song is to look up the writer/ publisher information on ASCAP, BMI, or SESAC here in the US and figure out if performance royalties are actively being collected on the performance of the piece.  With the exception of new and 'approved' arrangements of PD compositions collecting reduced royalties, most of the songs indexed are actively protected copyrights.
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« Reply #94 on: May 13, 2015, 09:56AM »

In a word, No.  By purchasing the product you have satisfied your legal obligation, through the parent company, to own a copy of the folio/ sheet music in exchange for paying a license fee (the cost of the book).  In order to take someone else's sound recording, the cd, and use that in a video that you produced embedding that sound into your video is only permitted and accomplished by executing a synchronization license with the publisher and master use license with the owner of the soundrecording simultaneously. If you were to re record the accompanying music in your own way and use that, then you would in fact be the owner of that specific sound recording, however, you would still have to execute a mechanical license to re record the original accompaniment you were recording...in any sense, you have to license the right to use other people's copyright in your own endeavors. This doesn't always mean you have to pay because sometimes writers and publishers give gratis licenses (dependent on several factors), however, the licensing process always has to occur, even in the minimal sense of the process.

I understand and I thank you. Your answer makes sense to me and connects with other information on a similar matter from another source.

However, YouTube being what it is, I suspect that unless it gets "Napstered", it wouldn't be worth any corporation's effort to come after ME for a few recordings I have done that violate copyright laws; especially since there is no money gained by me. If, however, my simple recordings go viral and produce a handsome revenue stream from advertising, then bar the door! A more likely scenario is that they would go after YouTube and YouTube might, in turn be legally required to go after me and others like me - which would probably only amount to either a warning or a banishment. In that Napster debacle, we all heard the horror stories of a few select individuals getting rocked for the music they had downloaded. But those individuals reportedly had hundreds of thousands of downloads and may have been distributing them. I had about 10,000 downloads and never lost one minute of sleep worrying about the copyright cops coming after me. Small potatoes.

That said, perhaps YouTube WILL be the next "Napster" case. There certainly is no shortage of violations on that site! Further, since it's easy to grab an mp3 file from a YouTube vid, I have to wonder what is keeping the music industry at bay. Virtually any new artist currently hot is on YouTube, whether they want to be or not. So why bother to buy the tune on Amazon or Itunes or wherever, when it's a simple matter to grab an mp3 from off YouTube!

The whole thing seems to me to be a mess and I think it was Napster that stood the music industry on it's head. Also seems to me that there has been a beneficial outcome to the consumer. Music is now more accessible than ever and at a dollar a tune, affordable by nearly everyone AND the artist is getting a piece of it, which they should.

I don't blame anyone for wishing to take the high ground and I'll think twice about putting what I mentioned on YouTube just for the principle of it, if nothing else. STILL... It is also my understanding that copyright laws permit latitude when music is used as an educational resource. When I post a recording I have done from a source such as say, MMO - it is for educational purposes only. No one in their right mind would point to my ridiculous effort and state that it is commercial-grade quality. Lol.

Thanks again,

...Geezer
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« Reply #95 on: May 13, 2015, 10:38AM »

Was that a question for me? I am sorry I am new here- just trying to get a feel for the forum/ posting etiquette lol.

You can pretty much offer any answer to any question here.  :D

Quote
Copyright varies in country to country...here in the US we have renewal options that extend the life of copyright sometimes exceptionally longer than in other countries...Canada gives copyright less of a timeline...Asian countries also have a 'writer's life + 50 years' policy in place....


Peter and the Wolf interested me because it was mentioned in the Supreme court case cited above.


Here's the problem, as I see it, with "Peter and the Wolf," (composed in 1936 by Prokofiev(1891-1953), first published in 1937 in the USSR) as an example of copyright restoration.

Given the relevant dates about it, if this was ever regarded as PD in the US it would be because its original foreign (Soviet) publication did not conform to US copyright law at the time. Such works were regarded as instantly PD, right?

Current US copyright law restored copyright to such "non-conforming" works *IF* they were not already in the PD in their home country on Jan 1, 1996.

However, Soviet copyright law during Prokofiev's time gave a copyright term of only "life plus 15".  That would put PATW in the PD by 1968 even in its home country.

In 1974 the Soviet Union joined the Universal Copyright Convention and extended copyright to "life plus 25" but only for works not already PD, so that would not have affected PATW.

Since this work was already PD in its home country before Jan 1, 1996... I'm wondering how it qualifies to have its copyright restored today.  It should not be eligible for that.

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« Reply #96 on: May 13, 2015, 11:13AM »

Hmm- well first off thanks for the great response- it is very interesting to read all of the material you supplied.

When I look at PATW I look at the first date of publication that it is acknowledged by the US...which I believe falls into line here:

1923 through 1963
Published with notice and the copyright was renewed
95 years after publication date

That would be the best possible explanation for why this composition would still be viable as not PD.  The song is actually PD in Canada...I would assume that is isn't PD here in the US and that is because it has been placed in the above category.  In the US, you are able to renew copyrights within a certain window of time following 'x' years following the author's death, in fact, you can even renew the copyrights in the name of that author's heirs and not specifically in their name.

You find this process prevalent in American jazz catalogs.

Our copyright law here in the US gives certain opportunities to the life and welfare of compositions that are not recognized in other countries...like renewable registrations referenced above are only recognized here...if that same song was licensed in the UK then only the original copyright holder would be entitled to collect income from that exploit leaving the new registrant partners solely collecting income domestically here in the US in exploits that take place, in part or in whole, here.

In the grand scheme of things...I don't believe that Russian's stance on the composition means as much as one would assume here in the US because we follow the US copyright law.
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« Reply #97 on: May 13, 2015, 11:45AM »

The US copyright law changed (I think it was 1978) and a number of works went Public Domain for a short period of time and then reverted to Public Domain.  I know a couple of Gershwin pieces went this way (we were able to buy them) and a LOT of Soviet music including a number of Shostakovich symphonies, and Prokofiev pieces (including Peter and the Wolf).  When the new law kicked in, these pieces went back under copyright.

While I have to pay royalties on performing these works, I don't think I have to return the sheet music back to the publisher who has revoked sale.
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« Reply #98 on: May 13, 2015, 11:51AM »

I have never heard of a publisher revoking sale of folio....that's more than half of their business.

In the United States a publisher cannot stop you from licensing their compositions to perform or record.
#statutorylicense
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BGuttman
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« Reply #99 on: May 13, 2015, 11:53AM »

That I understand.  And my orchestra maintains a membership in ASCAP to pay the royalties for any copyrighted work we perform.  Fortunately their fees aren't as ridiculous as the ones we have to pay for rentals... >:(
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Bruce Guttman
Solo Trombone, Hollis Town Band
Section Ldr, Merrimack Valley Philharmonic Orch.
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