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The Trombone ForumPractice BreakChit-ChatPurely Politics(Moderators: bhcordova, RedHotMama, BFW) Transcript of Republican Candidates' Debate - any thoughts???
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SensitiveJohn
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« Reply #220 on: Feb 28, 2012, 05:05AM »

Gravity is just a theory.
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Russ White

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« Reply #221 on: Feb 28, 2012, 06:39AM »

http://westorlandonews.com/2011/06/06/koch-brothers-in-forefront-of-oil-speculation/
http://thinkprogress.org/economy/2011/04/13/153206/koch-industries-price-gouging/
http://crooksandliars.com/karoli/pain-gas-pump-blame-kochs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9cd2UfqtFm8

The Koch Bros are major drivers of the oil speculation that is causing the price increases we are seeing. They want to build the pipeline, and are spending millions of dollars through their PACs to spread misinformation and lies about what is going on. They are part of the group which has pladged to spend $100 million on this next election, but I'm guessing it will be way more than that, but we will never know, thanks to Citizen'a United. Even if the Kochs spent the entire $100 million themselves, it would not even be pocket change for them. They could spend that much 699 more times, based on the estimates of their fortunes. Think about those numbers for a minute. A system which allows the accumulation of that kind of wealth while there are starving and dying kids is seriously FUBARed. We need to restore the balance that has only existed for a very short period in this country, from the end of WWII to the election of Reagan.
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« Reply #222 on: Feb 28, 2012, 07:16AM »

Gravity is just a theory.

No.  Gravity is a Law.  So all we need to do is find the body that enacted the Law and have them repeal it.  Then maybe we can have all these wacko candidates fly off to Mars where they really belong :-P Evil
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ronkny

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« Reply #223 on: Feb 28, 2012, 07:17AM »

Gravity is just a theory.
Engineer?
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« Reply #224 on: Feb 28, 2012, 07:56AM »

Koch Industries responds to attacks:
http://freebeacon.com/koch-industries-obama-trying-to-chill-free-speech-and-squelch-dissent/

Excerpt:
Dear Mr. Messina:
Because every American has the right to take part in the public discourse on matters that affect the future of our country, I feel compelled to respond directly about a fundraising letter you sent out on February 24 denouncing Koch. It is both surprising and disappointing that the President would allow his re-election team to send such an irresponsible and misleading letter to his supporters.

For example, it is false that our “business model is to make millions by jacking up prices at the pump.” Our business vision begins and ends with value creation — real, long-term value for customers and for society. We own no gasoline stations and the part of our business you allude to, oil and gas refining, actually lowers the price of gasoline by increasing supply. Either you simply misunderstand the way commodities markets work or you are misleading your supporters and the rest of the American people

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Russ White

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« Reply #225 on: Feb 28, 2012, 08:28AM »

Koch Industries responds to attacks:
http://freebeacon.com/koch-industries-obama-trying-to-chill-free-speech-and-squelch-dissent/

Excerpt:
Dear Mr. Messina:
Because every American has the right to take part in the public discourse on matters that affect the future of our country, I feel compelled to respond directly about a fundraising letter you sent out on February 24 denouncing Koch. It is both surprising and disappointing that the President would allow his re-election team to send such an irresponsible and misleading letter to his supporters.

For example, it is false that our “business model is to make millions by jacking up prices at the pump.” Our business vision begins and ends with value creation — real, long-term value for customers and for society. We own no gasoline stations and the part of our business you allude to, oil and gas refining, actually lowers the price of gasoline by increasing supply. Either you simply misunderstand the way commodities markets work or you are misleading your supporters and the rest of the American people



Actions speak far louder than words. They do blow smoke about as good as anybody on the planet, though!
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« Reply #226 on: Feb 28, 2012, 04:55PM »

DDickerson, you're missing what I'm saying, at least.

Increasing supply of fuel should decrease the price. OPEC has long tried to enforce production quotas to keep prices high.

So, your question is, why wouldn't increasing domestic production do the same thing? It would, in theory, but only in the proportion of the domestic increase to the entire world production of oil. In other words, domestic oil isn't some special substance that we get to use for free--it just goes into the hopper with the rest of the oil.

In practice, Mideast oil is less expensive because it's generally less expensive to extract and refine. Plus the capacity already exists, and the Saudis are our allies.

I find it telling that you put the word 'beg' in quotes, implying that Schumer used it, because it's an unflattering characterization. Maybe you could find the quote where he used that word. It's not very honest on your part.

As regards the last part, again who are the 'you guys' that you are addressing? Name the members here who are obligated to defend something Obama does that they disagree with? I think sometimes you project your way of thinking onto other people who are more thoughtful.

And yes, if Obama 'caves' on any issue before the election, I guarantee that it will be spun as 'not a cave'. You're just brilliant. When has any candidate or campaign spun a decision as a 'cave'? You're continually excited over things that the rest of us take for granted.

And now Obama Says regarding the TransCanada Pipeline announcement:
"Moving oil from the Midwest to the world-class, state-of-the-art refineries on the Gulf Coast will modernize our infrastructure, create jobs, and encourage American energy production,"

Now our refineries are described as "state-of-the-art" as opposed to dirty refineries, someone on here once said. And it will "Modernize", "create jobs", and encourage "energy production".

Bottomline, when obama is against it, you guys jump in here and back him up. When he praises pipelines to Texas, you guys will jump in here and back him up!

You guys sound like a Maytag Washing Machine going thruogh a dozen "Spin Cycles". :)

Keep up the good works!
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« Reply #227 on: Feb 28, 2012, 05:01PM »

I don't think that Obama was against it, he is a wolf in sheep's clothing afterall.  He just wanted to wait until a plan was developed and approved so that it can be done safely.  The Alaska pipeline had plenty of blunders, and that was up in Alaska where nobody lives.  We can't have leaking pipelines in America proper.
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« Reply #228 on: Feb 28, 2012, 06:08PM »

Oh, for crying out loud, DD. Obama has said publicly that he is not against the concept df the pipeline. He, along with any one who considers public safety and ecological issues to be as important as corporate profits,wants to make absolutely sure it is done right, and the Republicans, almost certainly under massive pressure from the Kochs, tried to ramrod it through. If it really is a worthwhile,project, it will get done. The rush to getit done makes me wonder what we're not being told. With thenKochs, it could be  anything.
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« Reply #229 on: Feb 28, 2012, 09:57PM »

Oh, for crying out loud, DD. Obama has said publicly that he is not against the concept df the pipeline. He, along with any one who considers public safety and ecological issues to be as important as corporate profits,wants to make absolutely sure it is done right, and the Republicans, almost certainly under massive pressure from the Kochs, tried to ramrod it through. If it really is a worthwhile,project, it will get done. The rush to getit done makes me wonder what we're not being told. With thenKochs, it could be  anything.

No, Obama is using this issue as a political ball in the hopes that he can get another term. This pipeline has been in the works for a long time, and it is not getting ramrodded through. Obama is just holding our economy and energy policy hostage in order to get elected. Pure and simple.

This TransCanada pipeline is independent of his control or veto, so he had to play along. Believe me, if he thought he had the power to contain it, he would.
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« Reply #230 on: Feb 28, 2012, 10:30PM »

Oh, for crying out loud, DD. Obama has said publicly that he is not against the concept df the pipeline. He, along with any one who considers public safety and ecological issues to be as important as corporate profits,wants to make absolutely sure it is done right, and the Republicans, almost certainly under massive pressure from the Kochs, tried to ramrod it through. If it really is a worthwhile,project, it will get done. The rush to getit done makes me wonder what we're not being told. With thenKochs, it could be  anything.
The Kochs.  Wish it were the Whites?
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« Reply #231 on: Feb 28, 2012, 11:52PM »

Bottomline, when obama is against it, you guys jump in here and back him up. When he praises pipelines to Texas, you guys will jump in here and back him up!

You guys sound like a Maytag Washing Machine going thruogh a dozen "Spin Cycles". :)

Keep up the good works!


"You guys." Again.

You were responding to my post, so I must be one of the guys that supports Obama on both sides of the pipeline issue. Show me the posts, you big fat [word that's not a TOU violation].

Of course, you can't show the posts, because you made it up. My dad used to say if you play with tar, some of it is bound to stick. You read a lot of dishonest stuff (I know, because you repost some of it). It's starting to stick.

Pants on fire.
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« Reply #232 on: Feb 29, 2012, 04:29AM »

No, Obama is using this issue as a political ball in the hopes that he can get another term. This pipeline has been in the works for a long time, and it is not getting ramrodded through. Obama is just holding our economy and energy policy hostage in order to get elected. Pure and simple.

This TransCanada pipeline is independent of his control or veto, so he had to play along. Believe me, if he thought he had the power to contain it, he would.

Get your facts straight, please.

Obama has not outright rejected the Keystone XL Pipeline.  He has said the environmental review is not complete.  The Republicans issued an artificial deadline for him to approve the pipeline, but the deadline expired without completion of the environmental review.  So Obama refused to approve the pipeline, although he said he would approve it if the environmental review was completed and it was not an environmental threat.

The Republicans are cherry-picking facts to try to bash Obama.

You are perfectly within your rights not to want to vote for the guy, but you are not within your rights to try to justify your actions with untruths.
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« Reply #233 on: Feb 29, 2012, 04:35AM »

The Kochs.  Wish it were the Whites?

Not only no, but F**K, NO! I'm far richer than those ego-centric, power hungry, megalomaniacs. I just don't have as much money.
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« Reply #234 on: Feb 29, 2012, 07:00AM »

This illustrates perfectly that atheists are on the bottom rung of the totem poll in our society.
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« Reply #235 on: Feb 29, 2012, 07:04AM »

This illustrates perfectly that atheists are on the bottom rung of the totem poll in our society.
"This"?  Don't know
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« Reply #236 on: Feb 29, 2012, 11:24AM »

"This"?  Don't know
It was probably intended for another thread.  Sorry.  I'm blaming the POS iPhone.
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« Reply #237 on: Feb 29, 2012, 02:06PM »

I always blame the Kitteh!  :)
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« Reply #238 on: Feb 29, 2012, 02:22PM »

It was probably intended for another thread.  Sorry.  I'm blaming the POS iPhone.
You sure it wasn't the "devil republicans"?
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« Reply #239 on: Feb 29, 2012, 02:28PM »

Eenie meanie
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