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Author Topic: What is Romney hiding?  (Read 89342 times)
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actikid
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« on: Jul 13, 2012, 08:08PM »

Sure seems like he is weaving quite a web of deceit.
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« Reply #1 on: Jul 14, 2012, 06:40AM »

this column by charles blow

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/14/opinion/blow-what-a-tangled-web.html?_r=1&partner=rss&emc=rss

has links to the Boston Globe investigation

http://articles.boston.com/2012-07-12/politics/32633322_1_bain-capital-mitt-romney-financial-disclosure

which discusses the issue regarding when Romney left Bain, in 1999 as he now claims or later as the documents show:

Quote
Evidence emerged last week in reports by Mother Jones that Romney had maintained an ongoing leadership role at Bain beyond February 1999. Citing SEC documents, the magazine said Romney had played a role in Bain investments “until at least the end of 1999” and that a 2001 document listed him as a member of the “management committee” of Bain funds. Talking Points Memo reported this week on additional SEC filings listing Romney’s position with Bain in July 2000 and February 2001.

A former SEC commissioner told the Globe that the SEC documents listing Romney as Bain’s chief executive between 1999 and 2002 cannot be dismissed so easily.

“You can’t say statements filed with the SEC are meaningless. This is a fact in an SEC filing,” said Roberta S. Karmel, now a professor at Brooklyn Law School.

“It doesn’t make a whole lot of sense to say he was technically in charge on paper but he had nothing to do with Bain’s operations,” Karmel continued. “Was he getting paid? He’s the sole stockholder. Are you telling me he owned the company but had no say in its investments?”

The Globe found nine SEC filings submitted by four different business entities after February 1999 that describe Romney as Bain Capital’s boss; some show him with managerial control over five Bain Capital entities that were formed in January 2002, according to records in Delaware, where they were incorporated.

http://articles.boston.com/2012-07-12/politics/32633322_1_bain-capital-mitt-romney-financial-disclosure/2

Quote

And financial disclosure documents Romney filed in Massachusetts show that he was paid as a Bain Capital executive while he directed the Olympics.

When he was named chief executive of the Salt Lake Organizing Committee on Feb. 11, 1999, Romney declared that he would not accept the job’s $285,000 annual salary until the Games were over and he had proven his turnaround worth.

Romney continued to draw a six-figure salary from Bain Capital, according to State Ethics Commission forms.

In Romney’s 2002 race for governor, he testified before the state Ballot Law Commission that his separation from Bain in 1999 had been a “leave of absence” and not a final departure.

http://articles.boston.com/2012-07-12/politics/32633322_1_bain-capital-mitt-romney-financial-disclosure/3
 
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Allen
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ronkny

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« Reply #2 on: Jul 14, 2012, 07:19AM »

http://factcheck.org/2012/07/romneys-bain-years-new-evidence-same-conclusion/
http://www.politico.com/blogs/media/2012/07/factcheckorg-little-new-in-globe-story-128751.html
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« Reply #3 on: Jul 14, 2012, 07:33AM »

ronnky

thanks for the cites but neither discuss the issue raised by this:

Quote


And financial disclosure documents Romney filed in Massachusetts show that he was paid as a Bain Capital executive while he directed the Olympics.

When he was named chief executive of the Salt Lake Organizing Committee on Feb. 11, 1999, Romney declared that he would not accept the job’s $285,000 annual salary until the Games were over and he had proven his turnaround worth.

Romney continued to draw a six-figure salary from Bain Capital, according to State Ethics Commission forms.

In Romney’s 2002 race for governor, he testified before the state Ballot Law Commission that his separation from Bain in 1999 had been a “leave of absence” and not a final departure.

http://articles.boston.com/2012-07-12/politics/32633322_1_bain-capital-mitt-romney-financial-disclosure/3

passive investors do not draw salary and a "leave of adsence is not a final departure".

SEC filings are binding legal documents under oath, I believe.
 

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Allen
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ronkny

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« Reply #4 on: Jul 14, 2012, 07:37AM »

ronnky

thanks for the cites but neither discuss the issue raised by this:

http://articles.boston.com/2012-07-12/politics/32633322_1_bain-capital-mitt-romney-financial-disclosure/3

passive investors do not draw salary and a "leave of adsence is not a final departure".

SEC filings are binding legal documents under oath, I believe.
 


Second article;
" that he was anything but a passive, absentee owner during that time, as both Romney and Bain have long said"
Owner's still draw a salary. What's the problem? You can be an owner and not be actively involved. Which is what Romney said.
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« Reply #5 on: Jul 14, 2012, 07:40AM »

http://elections.huffingtonpost.com/pollster/2012-massachusetts-president-romney-vs-obama?gem

People that know about Romney, want nothing to do with him.
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ronkny

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« Reply #6 on: Jul 14, 2012, 07:45AM »

Massachusetts will never vote for a Republican for pres. Not since Reagan. 8/10 years voting for the dem candidate. Half of the numnuts in MA voted for Carter in 1980. So it's not a Romney thing.  It's a Republican thing.
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« Reply #7 on: Jul 14, 2012, 07:46AM »

Second article;
" that he was anything but a passive, absentee owner during that time, as both Romney and Bain have long said"
Owner's still draw a salary. What's the problem. You can be an owner and not be actively involved. Which is what Romney said.

passive investors draw dividends

employees get paid a salary

an owner has a partnership draw

perhaps we are argueing over semantics???

I've heard of passive investors/partners in a general/limited partnership but a passive owner????
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Allen
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« Reply #8 on: Jul 14, 2012, 07:53AM »

Massachusetts will never vote for a Republican for pres. Not since Reagan. 8/10 years voting for the dem candidate. Half of the numnuts in MA voted for Carter in 1980. So it's not a Romney thing.  It's a Republican thing.
Well, Romney was elected Governor of Massachusetts once.  And, Scott Brown was elected in a statewide race too.  And, as you mentioned, folks in Massachusetts did vote for Reagan over Carter.

And, btw, Carter isn't the devil, Romney is.  That's what Romney is hiding.  He has been serving his master, Mephistopheles, by destroying the lives of the workers when he takes over a company.

And numnuts might not be a fair thing to call people from Massachusetts.  Massachusetts has the best education in the country.
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ronkny

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« Reply #9 on: Jul 14, 2012, 07:58AM »

passive investors draw dividends

employees get paid a salary

an owner has a partnership draw

perhaps we are argueing over semantics???

I've heard of passive investors/partners in a general/limited partnership but a passive owner????

"Jill E. Fisch, a professor at the University of Pennsylvania Law School and co-director of the Institute for Law and Economics, said Romney would not have committed a felony by listing himself as managing director — even if he now claims he had no role in running the company after February 1999. There is no legal obligation to describe how active one is in the day-to-day management of the company, she said. And just because he held title of managing director doesn’t necessarily mean that he’s responsible for decisions like layoffs or outsourcing."
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ronkny

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« Reply #10 on: Jul 14, 2012, 08:03AM »

Well, he was elected Governor here once.  And, Brown was elected in a statewide race here too.  And, as you mentioned, folks here did vote for Reagan.

And, btw, Carter isn't the devil, Romney is.
Carter was an idiot as president.  MA voted 42-42, Reagan -Carter. Reagan won by .2% in MA.
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BGuttman
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« Reply #11 on: Jul 14, 2012, 08:04AM »

"Jill E. Fisch, a professor at the University of Pennsylvania Law School and co-director of the Institute for Law and Economics, said Romney would not have committed a felony by listing himself as managing director — even if he now claims he had no role in running the company after February 1999. There is no legal obligation to describe how active one is in the day-to-day management of the company, she said. And just because he held title of managing director doesn’t necessarily mean that he’s responsible for decisions like layoffs or outsourcing."

And in the same light the President of the US is not directly involved with things like setting OSHA regulations, but you clearly blame him for any you don't like.

Romney's name is on the masthead and he gets tainted with all the things done under his watch.  If he wanted to divorce himself from the actions of the company he should have resigned.  He can keep all his stock and collect dividends, but he then isn't considered directly responsible for the actions of the company.

My problem with Romney, more than his activities at Bain, is that he has no apparent program to offer as an alternative to Obama's.  And this appears to be intentional.  He's running as NotObama.
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« Reply #12 on: Jul 14, 2012, 08:07AM »

And in the same light the President of the US is not directly involved with things like setting OSHA regulations, but you clearly blame him for any you don't like.

Romney's name is on the masthead and he gets tainted with all the things done under his watch.  If he wanted to divorce himself from the actions of the company he should have resigned.  He can keep all his stock and collect dividends, but he then isn't considered directly responsible for the actions of the company.

My problem with Romney, more than his activities at Bain, is that he has no apparent program to offer as an alternative to Obama's.  And this appears to be intentional.  He's running as NotObama.
I clearly blame Obama for OSHA regs?  Never said that.  I blame gov't. And in WA, our gov't gestapo is WISHA.  OSHA is nothing in WA.  Obama didn't start OSHA and doesn't oversee OSHA. Obama hasn't had an original idea in almost 4 years.  Stop making stuff up. Please.
NotObama is good enough for me. 
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« Reply #13 on: Jul 14, 2012, 08:09AM »

NotObama
I've also seen it as "NObama."
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« Reply #14 on: Jul 14, 2012, 10:16AM »

I've also seen it as "NObama."
Tamayta tomato.  Evil
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« Reply #15 on: Jul 14, 2012, 10:25AM »

What part of "sole shareholder" is hard to understand?

Ask yourself this simple question.  If you are sitting in Utah, and most of your personal fortune is in this company of which you are the sole shareholder, and it lists you as the CEO, how likely is it that your underlings are going to make decisions to outsource jobs, send companies into bankruptcy, and raid pension accounts without consulting you?

And if you would allow people to do that in your company without your knowledge, are you really qualified to be President of the United States?
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« Reply #16 on: Jul 14, 2012, 10:33AM »

What part of "sole shareholder" is hard to understand?

Ask yourself this simple question.  If you are sitting in Utah, and most of your personal fortune is in this company of which you are the sole shareholder, and it lists you as the CEO, how likely is it that your underlings are going to make decisions to outsource jobs, send companies into bankruptcy, and raid pension accounts without consulting you?

And if you would allow people to do that in your company without your knowledge, are you really qualified to be President of the United States?
Keep grasping.  This is Obama's ONLY strategy.  Pretty **** poor campaign.
It's called delegation. And he was on his way out.  Obviously a very well run company.  He lead them well enough that they could work on their own.
"No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President; neither shall any person be eligible to that office who shall not have attained to the age of thirty-five years, and been fourteen years a resident within the United States."
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« Reply #17 on: Jul 14, 2012, 10:36AM »

It's called delegation.
I would not want a President who delegated such strategic decisions.

And I don't believe Romney is credible on this point.  it is not reasonable that anybody would ever delegate decisions of that magnitude.  He is either a liar or stupid, and I don't think he is stupid.
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« Reply #18 on: Jul 14, 2012, 10:41AM »

I would not want a President who delegated such strategic decisions.

And I don't believe Romney is credible on this point.  it is not reasonable that anybody would ever delegate decisions of that magnitude.  He is either a liar or stupid, and I don't think he is stupid.
Why not?  He's the only shareholder so he'd only hurt himself. Right?
I wouldn't want Obama to make such "strategic decisions".  He's incapable.
Hmm.  Politifact.com and Factcheck.org only work for you when you agree with them?
Keep grasping.
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« Reply #19 on: Jul 14, 2012, 10:46AM »

For me, the salient issue isn't so much when Romney left Bain, but that his story on that date has changed.  He used to say that he was a "part-timer" on a leave of absence who had to fly by home for "board meetings and the like".  No it isn't political tenable for that to be his position so he was completely uninvolved?

I have my own opinion of Romney completely apart from Bain, and this plays into it - that he is untrustworthy.
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