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The Trombone ForumHorns, Gear, and EquipmentInstruments(Moderators: tbone62, Greg Waits) Shires Q&A, what would you like to know?
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Willy de Woofer
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« Reply #1160 on: Apr 24, 2017, 11:04PM »

Dear Sir. I send an email to Shires but got no reaction till now!? So I ask the question directly to you. I really like my two Conn 6H bones from around 1960. I like them more than my custom Edwards Jazz. Before that I played big horns like King 5B, Bach 42, etc.
I studied classical trombone at a Conservatory. Once I played at a very old King 2B Silversonic and was also great for me.
Two weeks ago I met the Shires dealer in the Netherlands. He invited me to try Shires small bore. Can you give me an advice about the configuration in front? Thanks a lot for your help. p.s. maybe you can look in my topic "from 5B to 2B in 40 years"?
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griffinben

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« Reply #1161 on: Apr 25, 2017, 12:14PM »

Dear Sir. I send an email to Shires but got no reaction till now!? So I ask the question directly to you. I really like my two Conn 6H bones from around 1960. I like them more than my custom Edwards Jazz. Before that I played big horns like King 5B, Bach 42, etc.
I studied classical trombone at a Conservatory. Once I played at a very old King 2B Silversonic and was also great for me.
Two weeks ago I met the Shires dealer in the Netherlands. He invited me to try Shires small bore. Can you give me an advice about the configuration in front? Thanks a lot for your help. p.s. maybe you can look in my topic "from 5B to 2B in 40 years"?

Hello Willy,

I'm sorry you didn't receive our reply, I remember answering the question personally.  Perhaps it went in your spam folder.  In either event, please email me directly: ben@seshires.com and I will be sure to get back to you.

reading your post here I am not entirely sure what you are asking.  I would need to know more about the Shires trombones you tried in the Netherlands (which models) and what you thought about them. 

If you are looking for an instrument like a mid-60's 6H, might I recommend the following specs:

Bell: 2YLW 8 or 2YM T8 8
Tuning Slide: SY1.5 or SY1.0
Slide: T00LW or T00

I hope this is helpful, I will look for your email to ben@seshires.com soon

-Ben
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griffinben

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« Reply #1162 on: Apr 25, 2017, 12:14PM »

Sorry if this has already been asked, but are there any plans to do a Q series small bore horn?

Stay tuned...
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Willy de Woofer
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« Reply #1163 on: Apr 25, 2017, 02:01PM »

Hello Willy,

I'm sorry you didn't receive our reply, I remember answering the question personally.  Perhaps it went in your spam folder.  In either event, please email me directly: ben@seshires.com and I will be sure to get back to you.

reading your post here I am not entirely sure what you are asking.  I would need to know more about the Shires trombones you tried in the Netherlands (which models) and what you thought about them. 

If you are looking for an instrument like a mid-60's 6H, might I recommend the following specs:

Bell: 2YLW 8 or 2YM T8 8
Tuning Slide: SY1.5 or SY1.0
Slide: T00LW or T00

I hope this is helpful, I will look for your email to ben@seshires.com soon

-Ben

Dear Ben,

Thanks a lot for your answer. Probably something went wrong with the email. No problem. I'll try to send it again and to the adress you mention.

About the bones: I never played any Shires before. I am looking for an even more sonorous sound and less effort in playing. I am now 61 years old. I only teach and conduct, so don't play in an orchestra.

Kind regards, Wil
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Mark LaFratta
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« Reply #1164 on: Apr 25, 2017, 03:14PM »

Sauer model
MJL
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Mark J. La Fratta
Shires alto red brass bell nickel slide wBb rotor; Shires Sauer Model; Conn 62H Bass; Conn 12H Coprion; Markus Leuchter Eb Alto Sackbut, Boehm & Meinl Bb sackbut
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« Reply #1165 on: Apr 25, 2017, 09:01PM »

Stay tuned...

Spicy!
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griffinben

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« Reply #1166 on: Apr 26, 2017, 06:24AM »

Dear Ben,

Thanks a lot for your answer. Probably something went wrong with the email. No problem. I'll try to send it again and to the adress you mention.

About the bones: I never played any Shires before. I am looking for an even more sonorous sound and less effort in playing. I am now 61 years old. I only teach and conduct, so don't play in an orchestra.

Kind regards, Wil

Hello Wil,

Thank you for the clarification.  My best advice would be to get to a well stocked dealer and sample a variety of instruments.  "More sound for less effort" is a hallmark of all of our instruments, no matter what the bore size is.  If you have specific questions after that, or are looking for a particular characteristic that you did not find in what you tried, I'll be better able to make some more specific recommendations.  You can email me directly at ben@seshires.com at that time and we can discuss.

Ben
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Willy de Woofer
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« Reply #1167 on: Apr 26, 2017, 06:39AM »

Hello Wil,

Thank you for the clarification.  My best advice would be to get to a well stocked dealer and sample a variety of instruments.  "More sound for less effort" is a hallmark of all of our instruments, no matter what the bore size is.  If you have specific questions after that, or are looking for a particular characteristic that you did not find in what you tried, I'll be better able to make some more specific recommendations.  You can email me directly at ben@seshires.com at that time and we can discuss.

Ben

Dear Ben,

I will visit a dealer soon. Thanks for your kind reactions.

Regards, Wil
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wgwbassbone
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« Reply #1168 on: Apr 26, 2017, 06:54AM »

 Willy de Woofer

One of my favorite Forum names.  :)
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Dennis Clason

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« Reply #1169 on: Apr 26, 2017, 07:23AM »

Ben,

I've got a 1972 36B that I like a lot, but it's losing plating on the inner slide stockings and the slide is generally showing its age despite an overhaul a few years back. I'm thinking pretty seriously about replacing/adding a Shires slide to it, probably a 2547. My playing with this horn is mostly 1st part in brass band and (large) concert bands. I'm currently using an Elliott XT103.D.D4 setup.

1. Will I have to replace the slide receiver? Ideally, I'd like to be able to continue to use the Bach's original slide when I want to use it.
2. Is this likely to work out well, or should I stick with a straight .525 slide?

Thanks in advance.

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« Reply #1170 on: Apr 26, 2017, 08:03AM »

Dennis, I'm not Ben, but I have been thru a similar configuration. Currently I use a Shires .525 nickel slide with my 36G bell section. The Shires "fits" most of the time, but isn't secure enough for regular use. I measured a Bach 42 slide tenon with the thought of swapping slide tenons, and the inner diameter of the Bach tenon is slightly smaller that the outside diameter of the slide tube on the Shires, so it is not a direct fit. I am told that Shires makes a Bach tenon for their slides and I'm sure that Ben can weigh in on that.. Hope this helps.. Greg
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griffinben

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« Reply #1171 on: Apr 26, 2017, 08:39AM »

Ben,

I've got a 1972 36B that I like a lot, but it's losing plating on the inner slide stockings and the slide is generally showing its age despite an overhaul a few years back. I'm thinking pretty seriously about replacing/adding a Shires slide to it, probably a 2547. My playing with this horn is mostly 1st part in brass band and (large) concert bands. I'm currently using an Elliott XT103.D.D4 setup.

1. Will I have to replace the slide receiver? Ideally, I'd like to be able to continue to use the Bach's original slide when I want to use it.
2. Is this likely to work out well, or should I stick with a straight .525 slide?

Thanks in advance.



We've had a lot of people use our large bore and bass slides with different brands but few with medium bore.  I'd like to know a little more about what particular characteristics you are looking for out of a new slide and what you both like and dislike about your current set-up before making a recommendation in this particular instance.

I will provide some general information here for the greater good regarding this type of thing.

My first piece advice is always: beware.  When starting to swap pieces and parts between different manufacturers there is always potential for some adverse side effects or results, simply because the parts were not designed to be used together int he first place.  It's like dropping a Honda Accord V6 into a Toyota Camry but wanting to use the Toyota transmission.

The bell receiver/threaded tenon (slide side) is a separate part that can easily be swapped out to a 50/42/36 part.  There is no "Bach compatible" part that we manufacture at the factory, it can only be done aftermarket.  The lower inner tube extends into this piece and our slide tube length and Bach slide tube length is different, though I am not sure whether ours is longer or shorter off the top of my head right now.

Bach slide length is longer than Shires by 3/8", on bass, large bore, and medium bore models.  If you would like similar tuning, we usually recommend opting for an "L" (long) slide, which is a factory option for wide slides only.  Long slides tend to feel a little more "locked in" to the harmonic series.  Standard length slides move a little more easier through the harmonic series. 

Similarly, our standard width slides are narrower than both 42 and 36 bore instruments.  These are already "L"/long slide to compensate for the overall lengths lost from the narrow width.  They are not available with a further "L"/Long option.

Our "W"/Wide slides largely compare Bach large and medium bore instruments.  If you are looking for a replacement as close to a 36 I would recommend this, though our slide does play differently than a 36.  This slide works extremely well with the large shank MT receiver leadpipes, making it more open and more like a little big horn. 

Our 1.5 venturi leadpipes are most similar to standard leadpipes on a 50/42/36.

I hope this information is helpful.

Ben
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Willy de Woofer
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« Reply #1172 on: Apr 26, 2017, 08:57AM »

Willy de Woofer

One of my favorite Forum names.  :)

Hah, hah. This name I used at Audio/Hifi Stereo equipment. My other name was Pieter the Tweeter. Just having fun  :D
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« Reply #1173 on: Apr 29, 2017, 04:35PM »

Hi Ben -

I've acquired a B1.5NL leadpipe, which I like, but have a question - would you expect a mouthpiece to go in not as far in one of these?  Mine sits about 1/8" to 3/16" further out than it does in my B2. However the seating is stable - no wobble. Is this a typical variance?  I made sure that the receiver is clean.  This pipe does have the threads removed (it't a Shires collar, though, for sure) so I have a feeling it's been tinkered with, though, and that might be the reason.

Thanks!

Tim
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« Reply #1174 on: May 01, 2017, 06:19AM »

Hi Ben -

I've acquired a B1.5NL leadpipe, which I like, but have a question - would you expect a mouthpiece to go in not as far in one of these?  Mine sits about 1/8" to 3/16" further out than it does in my B2. However the seating is stable - no wobble. Is this a typical variance?  I made sure that the receiver is clean.  This pipe does have the threads removed (it't a Shires collar, though, for sure) so I have a feeling it's been tinkered with, though, and that might be the reason.

Thanks!

Tim

Hi Tim,

Once a leadpipe (or anything) has been modified all bets are off as to factory spec anymore.  The good news is that the mouthpiece sits cleanly, which means at least it's interfacing correctly.  Length of a "long" leadpipes should be 9 3/4".

There is some variation in leadpipe depth.  There was a time that the depths started backing out within what you quoted.  We changed the spec maybe 1 1/2-2 years ago.  It could be you have a leadpipe from that time.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Not to Shanghai a response with something related but different...

The opposite of this, a leadpipe fitting further in than it initially did, can be caused by twisting the mouthpiece excessively while applying downward force when inserting it into the receiver.  This habit, from our earliest days of trombonists, no doubt, will eventually stretch the metal, causing the mouthpiece to sink deeper and deeper. A light twist (no pressure) is all that is needed to seat the mouthpiece into the receiver.

Ben
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« Reply #1175 on: May 01, 2017, 08:36AM »

Thanks for the info!

I might want to come down sometime soon and test out some leadpipes... perhaps at the factory day coming up.  I assume you have quite a wide stock to test from?

Thanks,
Tim
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« Reply #1176 on: Jun 01, 2017, 03:58AM »

Hello , Ben !   Hi

I would like to have some numbers on the new mouthpieces, please !
Inner rim diameters and throat bore sizes on the 2G, 2MD, 1 1/2G and 1 1/2MD,D, and XD ..

Thanks ! Good!

Trond





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griffinben

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« Reply #1177 on: Jun 01, 2017, 06:30AM »

Hello , Ben !   Hi

I would like to have some numbers on the new mouthpieces, please !
Inner rim diameters and throat bore sizes on the 2G, 2MD, 1 1/2G and 1 1/2MD,D, and XD ..

Thanks ! Good!

Trond


Hello Trond,

You had written me via email but will post my answer here as well for the greater good.:

_________________________________________________ _________________________________________________ _______________________________

Hello Trond,

Thank you for your message, our mouthpiece specifications for the sizes you inquired about are as follows:

IDRimThroat
2G1.050.283
2MD1.070.283
1 1/2G1.070.277
1 1/2MD1.090.291
Our 2G and 1 1/2G are close in concept to traditional sizes using the same nomenclature.  The 2MD and 1 1/2MD feature a slightly more V-shaped cup and slightly larger inner rim diameters than their more traditional counterparts.  I should note that while the rim size measurements seem to be a size larger than what the number may suggest, the reality is that the rim profile lends only a slightly larger feeling, not a completely different size, which is why we decided to maintain the numeral sizes corresponding to how they actually feel.

_________________________________________________ _________________________________________________ _______________________________

We are working on putting up a mouthpiece size chart to our updated website.  I'll be sure to post here once it goes up.

Ben


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tbathras
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« Reply #1178 on: Jun 01, 2017, 06:51AM »

Since we're on mp specs...

What are the specs on the 1MD?

Thanks,
Tim
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Matt K

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« Reply #1179 on: Jun 01, 2017, 07:03AM »

Ben,

Any chance we could order underparts threaded for particular rims?

-Matt
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