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Author Topic: Wake Up, America: Take 3  (Read 25268 times)
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TromPhysics
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« Reply #20 on: Feb 09, 2016, 01:36AM »

Do you ever write pro capitalism or pro American op eds? Don't know

The government pouring federal subsidies into an already mature industry doesn't seem very Capitalist to me...


And does not being automatically pro-America or pro-Capitalism make it necessarily wrong? It is possible to have legitimate critiques of America and Capitalism.
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Baron von Bone
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« Reply #21 on: Feb 09, 2016, 04:13AM »

The government pouring federal subsidies into an already mature industry doesn't seem very Capitalist to me...
 
And does not being automatically pro-America or pro-Capitalism make it necessarily wrong? It is possible to have legitimate critiques of America and Capitalism.

Yeah, it's pretty telling when criticism of the act of criticism comes up, isn't it.
 
Advocating for improvements to quality of life that aren't approved by an accepted authority are plainly wrong.
You have to conform to an appropriate authority to be good ... clearly.
Noticing that anything is wrong, particularly openly, is anti-whatever you're criticizing.
 
Such is the nature of intellectual cowardice.
 
Note that these are the kinds of meta issues that underlie all discussion (and "discussion" or the effective prevention of discussion in many cases). Ignoring them can be harmful to the social climate.
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Russ White

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« Reply #22 on: Feb 09, 2016, 04:56AM »

Do you ever write pro capitalism or pro American op eds? Don't know

All of my columns are pro-America, although I am staunchly in favor of taking control of excesses perpetrated on the American people by the predatory Corporate capitalism that exists here today. Al Franken said it best......

"We love America just as much as they do. But in a different way. You see, they love America like a 4-year-old loves his mommy. Liberals love America like grown-ups. To a 4-year-old, everything Mommy does is wonderful and anyone who criticizes Mommy is bad. Grown-up love means actually understanding what you love, taking the good with the bad and helping your loved one grow. Love takes attention and work and is the best thing in the world. Thatís why we liberals want America to do the right thing. We know America is the hope of the world, and we love it and want it to do well."

I am not a "My country, right or wrong", or "Love it or Leave it" American. I am a "Change it or Lose it" American.
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« Reply #23 on: Feb 09, 2016, 07:14AM »

The government pouring federal subsidies into an already mature industry doesn't seem very Capitalist to me...


And does not being automatically pro-America or pro-Capitalism make it necessarily wrong? It is possible to have legitimate critiques of America and Capitalism.
Don't know
I just asked a question. Russ answered. Thanks for the help though.  Yeah, RIGHT.
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ronkny

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« Reply #24 on: Feb 09, 2016, 07:15AM »


Yeah, it's pretty telling when criticism of the act of criticism comes up, isn't it.
 
Advocating for improvements to quality of life that aren't approved by an accepted authority are plainly wrong.
You have to conform to an appropriate authority to be good ... clearly.
Noticing that anything is wrong, particularly openly, is anti-whatever you're criticizing.
 
Such is the nature of intellectual cowardice.
 
Note that these are the kinds of meta issues that underlie all discussion (and "discussion" or the effective prevention of discussion in many cases). Ignoring them can be harmful to the social climate.
Thanks Niedermeier.  Wow.
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ronkny

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« Reply #25 on: Feb 09, 2016, 07:45AM »

All of my columns are pro-America, although I am staunchly in favor of taking control of excesses perpetrated on the American people by the predatory Corporate capitalism that exists here today. Al Franken said it best......

"We love America just as much as they do. But in a different way. You see, they love America like a 4-year-old loves his mommy. Liberals love America like grown-ups. To a 4-year-old, everything Mommy does is wonderful and anyone who criticizes Mommy is bad. Grown-up love means actually understanding what you love, taking the good with the bad and helping your loved one grow. Love takes attention and work and is the best thing in the world. Thatís why we liberals want America to do the right thing. We know America is the hope of the world, and we love it and want it to do well."

I am not a "My country, right or wrong", or "Love it or Leave it" American. I am a "Change it or Lose it" American.
I disagree. They are all pretty much whining and complaining about what's wrong with Anerica. Of course you can critique and criticize the US.  It just seems that your job is to blame republicans for everything. You don't need like an occupy protester. (That's not a good thing for anyone. Especially a man at your age and experience)  You also are sometimes hard to distinguish from protesters or politicians in other countries who hate us. Where's a column on Things America has done for good in this world? I'm sorry Russ but you are part of what's wrong with America right now. Adding to the polarization. It's sad.
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ronkny

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« Reply #26 on: Feb 09, 2016, 09:07AM »

Indefensible. Isn't it? :/
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« Reply #27 on: Feb 09, 2016, 10:23AM »

Indefensible. Isn't it? :/
Not at all. Pretty easy actually.  Don't know
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ronkny

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« Reply #28 on: Feb 09, 2016, 10:26AM »

Not at all. Pretty easy actually.  Don't know
Go ahead and defend it then.
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« Reply #29 on: Feb 09, 2016, 10:55AM »

I disagree. They are all pretty much whining and complaining about what's wrong with Anerica. Of course you can critique and criticize the US.  ...

All I hear from you and Dickerson is whining and complaining about what is wrong with the US.  Of course it's different from what Bernie whines and complains about.

It's OK to want to change the direction we are heading.  In fact, we have people pulling in opposite directions, so the movement should be fairly small.  That's one of the good points of this system.

The problem occurs when one side or the other gets too strong.  It used to be that Unions and Management were a counterbalance for each other.  Now with Unions removed from the picture there is nothing preventing Management from devaluing labor to the point where they will commit economic suicide since nobody will be left to buy their goods and services.  Henry Ford was wise when he offered his workers twice the going rate of pay to have them be able to afford to buy one of his cars.
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« Reply #30 on: Feb 09, 2016, 10:56AM »

Go ahead and defend it then.
Why? You didn't ask it to be defended. You just asked if it was defensible. And the answer is a very easy yes.

The entire critique could apply more accurately to itself than the quoted topic. Ie: you complain that Russ is "complaining" in your opinion. Kinda ironic. Pot calling the kettle black and all that.
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« Reply #31 on: Feb 09, 2016, 11:01AM »

All I hear from you and Dickerson is whining and complaining about what is wrong with the US. 

No, it's the liberals that are promoting change. Remember Obama's slogan?
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« Reply #32 on: Feb 09, 2016, 11:03AM »

No, it's the liberals that are promoting change. Remember Obama's slogan?
He just hoped to change and move forward.

The GOP still very much wants change. They just want to change things back to white male privilege where blacks were property and women were decoration.
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« Reply #33 on: Feb 09, 2016, 11:06AM »

No, it's the liberals that are promoting change. Remember Obama's slogan?

So change is inherently bad? This country was founded on change. We didn't like the very traditional Monarchy so we progressed to a Democratic Republic.

We didn't like the tradition of owning slaves, going back to the Old Testament, and decided to change that.

Perhaps now we've decided we're tired of the tradition of discriminating against gays, and want to change that.
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Baron von Bone
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« Reply #34 on: Feb 09, 2016, 11:09AM »

The problem occurs when one side or the other gets too strong.

 ... or too uncooperative, and/or decides to use alternative means that subvert and/or obstruct the system of government to achieve their political goals.
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ronkny

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« Reply #35 on: Feb 09, 2016, 11:18AM »


 ... or too uncooperative, and/or decides to use alternative means that subvert and/or obstruct the system of government to achieve their political goals.
Exactly.  Like Obama and his executive orders.
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« Reply #36 on: Feb 09, 2016, 11:26AM »

So change is inherently bad? This country was founded on change.

Constitution? Not so much.
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TromPhysics
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« Reply #37 on: Feb 09, 2016, 11:29AM »

Constitution? Not so much.

The Constitution isn't meant to be changed? So the Founding Fathers aren't the ones who came up with the amendment process?

The first thing they did to the Constitution was change it! The Bill of Rights is the first 10 Amendments, they weren't originally in the Constitution. And countless other instances of progress and corrections of injustices came about in the form of changes to the Constitution.
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« Reply #38 on: Feb 09, 2016, 11:32AM »

The Constitution isn't meant to be changed?

I said "not so much".
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« Reply #39 on: Feb 09, 2016, 11:34AM »

The Constitution isn't meant to be changed? So the Founding Fathers aren't the ones who came up with the amendment process?

The first thing they did to the Constitution was change it! The Bill of Rights is the first 10 Amendments, they weren't originally in the Constitution. And countless other instances of progress and corrections of injustices came about in the form of changes to the Constitution.
Changed through the amendment process only. Not the way the liberals say it should change. "Living and breathing document".
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Government is like a baby. An alimentary canal with a big appetite at one end and no sense of responsibility at the other.
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