Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length

 
Advanced search

1076490 Posts in 71359 Topics- by 18941 Members - Latest Member: Tigerprints
Jump to:  
Pages: [1] 2 3 4 5 6 ... 100   Go Down
Print
Author Topic: On Trump  (Read 73681 times)
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
Ellrod

*
Offline Offline

Location: North
Joined: Oct 30, 2001
Posts: 6108

View Profile
« on: Feb 29, 2016, 05:52PM »

J Oliver

http://youtu.be/DnpO_RTSNmQ
Logged
robcat2075

*
Offline Offline

Location: Dallas, Texas
Joined: Apr 19, 2009
Posts: 5705

View Profile
« Reply #1 on: Feb 29, 2016, 06:20PM »

B Obama..

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/k8TwRmX6zs4" target="_blank">https://www.youtube.com/v/k8TwRmX6zs4</a>
Logged

Robert Holmén

Hear me as I Play My Horn


Get your Popper, Dotzauer, or Kummer play-alongs!
gregs70

*
Offline Offline

Location: Cleveland, Ohio
Joined: Nov 6, 2005
Posts: 707

View Profile
« Reply #2 on: Feb 29, 2016, 07:45PM »

Vote for Drumpf! Better yet, don't...
Logged

I'm not a total idiot - there are still a few pieces missing!

King 3B-F, King 4B-F, Holton TR-180
Russ White

*
Offline Offline

Location: Orange City, Fl
Joined: Feb 27, 2007
Posts: 5085

View Profile
« Reply #3 on: Mar 02, 2016, 04:51AM »

B Obama..

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/k8TwRmX6zs4" target="_blank">https://www.youtube.com/v/k8TwRmX6zs4</a>

And, remember, when he was doing that routine the SEAL team was on its way into Pakistan to kill Bin Laden. THat man is amazing on many levels!
Logged

Better than yesterday, better yet tomorrow.
Baron von Bone
Fear is the Mind-Killer.

*
Offline Offline

Location: Athens, GA (USA)
Joined: Jul 16, 2002
Posts: 18297
"Reality Junkie"


View Profile
« Reply #4 on: Mar 02, 2016, 07:30AM »

A poorly chosen headline, IMO, for a more or less fair-minded article on Trump supporters.
Logged

- Feeding a troll just gives it a platform and amplifies its voice.
 
- Science is what we have learned about how to keep from fooling ourselves.  - Richard Feynman
- He who knows not and knows not that he knows not is a fool.   - Confucius
Molefsky

*
Offline Offline

Location: Ohio
Joined: Aug 18, 2005
Posts: 1144
"Very old photo..."


View Profile
« Reply #5 on: Mar 23, 2016, 09:25AM »

So I feel like a lot of the anti-trump furor is the product of his unartful expression of views that are not inline with the progressive left that have been recycled and amplified by both the left AND the right in order to try and put down the right wing populist insurgency. While I'm not a Trump supporter I feel more and more obligated to say that I don't really hate or despise the guy for what he says. Some of the things he discusses are kind of appealing in a way. I don't think he's any more racist than Bernie and I actually think he's more sane on a lot of social issues than anyone else in the GOP field.  Don't know

There, an actual post in this thread.
Logged

Molefsky
freelance trombonist
Full-time Environmental Engineering Consultant
BGuttman
Mad Chemist

*
*
Offline Offline

Location: Londonderry, NH, USA
Joined: Dec 12, 2000
Posts: 50533
"Almost Professional"


View Profile
« Reply #6 on: Mar 23, 2016, 09:34AM »

Trump isn't campaigning like the other candidates are.  He's on a major selling campaign.  He's selling Donald Trump.  And like most advertising campaigns he tries to sell while revealing the least.  He uses ambiguous arguments.  "Full of sound and fury, signifying nothing" (to quote Shakespeare).  What does "You're gonna love it" really mean?
Logged

Bruce Guttman
Solo Trombone, Hollis Town Band
Section Ldr, Merrimack Valley Philharmonic Orch.
Molefsky

*
Offline Offline

Location: Ohio
Joined: Aug 18, 2005
Posts: 1144
"Very old photo..."


View Profile
« Reply #7 on: Mar 23, 2016, 09:44AM »

Trump isn't campaigning like the other candidates are.  He's on a major selling campaign.  He's selling Donald Trump.  And like most advertising campaigns he tries to sell while revealing the least.  He uses ambiguous arguments.  "Full of sound and fury, signifying nothing" (to quote Shakespeare).  What does "You're gonna love it" really mean?

Exactly correct. Historically very liberal. He had GOP debate attendees in Texas cheering for planned parenthood. I just don't think the media narrative really captures what's going on at all.
Logged

Molefsky
freelance trombonist
Full-time Environmental Engineering Consultant
gregs70

*
Offline Offline

Location: Cleveland, Ohio
Joined: Nov 6, 2005
Posts: 707

View Profile
« Reply #8 on: Mar 23, 2016, 07:04PM »

So I feel like a lot of the anti-trump furor is the product of his unartful expression of views that are not inline with the progressive left that have been recycled and amplified by both the left AND the right in order to try and put down the right wing populist insurgency. While I'm not a Trump supporter I feel more and more obligated to say that I don't really hate or despise the guy for what he says. Some of the things he discusses are kind of appealing in a way. I don't think he's any more racist than Bernie and I actually think he's more sane on a lot of social issues than anyone else in the GOP field.  Don't know

There, an actual post in this thread.

How is Bernie racist?
Logged

I'm not a total idiot - there are still a few pieces missing!

King 3B-F, King 4B-F, Holton TR-180
Baron von Bone
Fear is the Mind-Killer.

*
Offline Offline

Location: Athens, GA (USA)
Joined: Jul 16, 2002
Posts: 18297
"Reality Junkie"


View Profile
« Reply #9 on: Mar 23, 2016, 08:13PM »

How is Bernie racist?

In case you're not just punking him--I'm pretty sure that's not what Molesfky's saying.
Logged

- Feeding a troll just gives it a platform and amplifies its voice.
 
- Science is what we have learned about how to keep from fooling ourselves.  - Richard Feynman
- He who knows not and knows not that he knows not is a fool.   - Confucius
Molefsky

*
Offline Offline

Location: Ohio
Joined: Aug 18, 2005
Posts: 1144
"Very old photo..."


View Profile
« Reply #10 on: Mar 23, 2016, 08:20PM »

As far as I can tell they're both labor protectionists making implausible claims about repatriating non-existent jobs. Neither is racist from what I've seen or read though Bernie has, rather transparently, adopted rhetoric to try and appeal to ethnic minority voters while applying classist generalizations to large swaths of Americans to appeal to his millenial base. I see them as being not so different from one another aside from the fact that many of Bernie's supporters seem to have an antagonistic or even violent streak.
Logged

Molefsky
freelance trombonist
Full-time Environmental Engineering Consultant
robcat2075

*
Offline Offline

Location: Dallas, Texas
Joined: Apr 19, 2009
Posts: 5705

View Profile
« Reply #11 on: Mar 23, 2016, 08:20PM »

Between Bernie and Trump... which one has been sued by the Federal Government for racially discriminatory practices in his housing developments?

Between Bernie and Trump...  which one has been arrested for protesting racially discriminatory practices in education?

Hmmm... both are equally racist, we are assured, and yet they have these completely different histories of behavior in this area. How can that be?

Logged

Robert Holmén

Hear me as I Play My Horn


Get your Popper, Dotzauer, or Kummer play-alongs!
Molefsky

*
Offline Offline

Location: Ohio
Joined: Aug 18, 2005
Posts: 1144
"Very old photo..."


View Profile
« Reply #12 on: Mar 23, 2016, 08:59PM »

Evidence of Trump discriminating or is it an instance of a company committing to some kind of practice that is determined to possibly be discriminatory? I do see Trump willing to talk to the Palestinian Authority and stand up for planned parenthood at GOP events.

Bernie is the candidate leading the push to superficially appeal to minority voters. Further, the willingness to gloss over real border concerns for Mexico and the U.S. alike to score cheap political points among an ill-informed base and his reaction to BLM demonstrators makes Bernie come off as a tad craven.
Logged

Molefsky
freelance trombonist
Full-time Environmental Engineering Consultant
Piano man
*
Offline Offline

Location:
Joined: Feb 10, 2006
Posts: 9818

View Profile
« Reply #13 on: Mar 23, 2016, 11:55PM »

The only times Trump comes close to getting in trouble with GOP primary voters is when he tells the truth. When he lies, he's fine.
Logged

"What gets us into trouble is not what we don't know, it's what we know for sure that just ain't so." --Mark Twain
Piano man
*
Offline Offline

Location:
Joined: Feb 10, 2006
Posts: 9818

View Profile
« Reply #14 on: Mar 23, 2016, 11:57PM »

Evidence of Trump discriminating or is it an instance of a company committing to some kind of practice that is determined to possibly be discriminatory? I do see Trump willing to talk to the Palestinian Authority and stand up for planned parenthood at GOP events.

Bernie is the candidate leading the push to superficially appeal to minority voters. Further, the willingness to gloss over real border concerns for Mexico and the U.S. alike to score cheap political points among an ill-informed base and his reaction to BLM demonstrators makes Bernie come off as a tad craven.

I appreciate your fresh look at these candidates. For the record, Trump's offense as a young man was actively and systematically avoiding minority rental applicants.
Logged

"What gets us into trouble is not what we don't know, it's what we know for sure that just ain't so." --Mark Twain
Baron von Bone
Fear is the Mind-Killer.

*
Offline Offline

Location: Athens, GA (USA)
Joined: Jul 16, 2002
Posts: 18297
"Reality Junkie"


View Profile
« Reply #15 on: Mar 24, 2016, 05:17AM »

Hmmm... both are equally racist, we are assured, and yet they have these completely different histories of behavior in this area. How can that be?

Because "[Trump's] a regular guy [just like me]. He eats Wendy's on his plane."
 
Trump is to many many Trumpers precisely what they want him to be--doesn't matter if he's really what they want him to be or not ... or, obviously, even anything close in many cases.
Logged

- Feeding a troll just gives it a platform and amplifies its voice.
 
- Science is what we have learned about how to keep from fooling ourselves.  - Richard Feynman
- He who knows not and knows not that he knows not is a fool.   - Confucius
Molefsky

*
Offline Offline

Location: Ohio
Joined: Aug 18, 2005
Posts: 1144
"Very old photo..."


View Profile
« Reply #16 on: Mar 24, 2016, 06:51AM »

The only times Trump comes close to getting in trouble with GOP primary voters is when he tells the truth. When he lies, he's fine.

I agree fully here, though perhaps for different reasons. He's much MUCH more liberal than his supporters, at least that's my perception.

Piano man, just in the interest of impartiality or thought experiment etc. I wonder if it was as simple as rental applicant is [insert ethnic minority] or if it was something more oblique that happened to correlate with ethnic discrimination. Like only applicants of certain credit scores combined with an income above $X.XX and with a college degree or working in certain industries. Or perhaps it was one of his manager's that took things too far etc. I don't know because those terms are all too ambiguous for me to say with any surety that Trump is a racist.I also have almost not familiarity whatsoever with those cases that took place decades ago.

Baron, your last sentence is exactly my take as well.
Logged

Molefsky
freelance trombonist
Full-time Environmental Engineering Consultant
bhcordova
Wielder of the Cat Litter Scoop

*
*
Offline Offline

Location: Nacogdoches, TX, USA
Joined: May 18, 2000
Posts: 7070
"Carpe Felix"


View Profile WWW
« Reply #17 on: Mar 24, 2016, 07:41AM »

He got fined by the federal government for housing discrimination.  No blacks who applied for apartments in his properties were approved.  Had nothing to do with income, education level, etc.  No blacks. At all. 
Logged

Billy Cordova, MBA
Forum Administrator
bcordova@tromboneforum.org

Beware the Jabberwock, my son! - Lewis Carroll

Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup - Anon.

St. Cecilia, pray for us.
Molefsky

*
Offline Offline

Location: Ohio
Joined: Aug 18, 2005
Posts: 1144
"Very old photo..."


View Profile
« Reply #18 on: Mar 24, 2016, 08:01AM »

He got fined by the federal government for housing discrimination.  No blacks who applied for apartments in his properties were approved.  Had nothing to do with income, education level, etc.  No blacks. At all. 

I'd be more careful throwing out absolutes with no sources. According to this analysis there was definite and obvious discrimination but not to the extent you're claiming and apparently it preceded Trump's involvement with the company and was such a common practice, industry wide, that they had to pass specific legislation about it and then target enforcement with stings.  Source:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/inside-the-governments-racial-bias-case-against-donald-trumps-company-and-how-he-fought-it/2016/01/23/fb90163e-bfbe-11e5-bcda-62a36b394160_story.html

Quote
The Trumps’ company had encountered allegations of discrimination before Donald Trump arrived. On at least seven occasions, people seeking apartments had filed complaints about alleged “discriminatory practices” with the New York City Commission on Human Rights.

The company resolved the complaints individually by offering apartments to each minority applicant, but critics in New York said the patterns of bias continued.

The article basically describes how some units were majority white and others majority black by design. This is absolutely discrimination based on race but not an outright refusal to rent properties to black tenants.

Quote
Civil rights groups in the city viewed the Trump company as just one example of a nationwide problem of housing discrimination. But targeting the Trumps provided a chance to have an impact, said Eleanor Holmes Norton, who was then chairwoman of the city’s human rights commission. “They were big names,” said Norton (D), now the District’s representative in Congress.

This is by no means an excuse but he was the newcomer to an established business in an established industry in an established market. Obviously he's made a lot of money working internationally and with people from a wide variety of backgrounds.
Logged

Molefsky
freelance trombonist
Full-time Environmental Engineering Consultant
Molefsky

*
Offline Offline

Location: Ohio
Joined: Aug 18, 2005
Posts: 1144
"Very old photo..."


View Profile
« Reply #19 on: Mar 24, 2016, 08:11AM »

Oh and according to the article the settlement didn't require the company to acknowledge any wrongdoing so maybe Trump does cut sweet deals.   :/ Eeek!
Logged

Molefsky
freelance trombonist
Full-time Environmental Engineering Consultant
Pages: [1] 2 3 4 5 6 ... 100   Go Up
Print
Jump to: