Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length

 
Advanced search

1066773 Posts in 70911 Topics- by 18693 Members - Latest Member: Marvin.neal62
Jump to:  
Pages: 1 ... 26 27 28 29 30 [31] 32   Go Down
Print
Author Topic: The election  (Read 15719 times)
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
BGuttman
Mad Chemist

*
*
Offline Offline

Location: Londonderry, NH, USA
Joined: Dec 12, 2000
Posts: 50037
"Almost Professional"


View Profile
« Reply #600 on: Jan 22, 2017, 10:41AM »

I think you are giving all sides more credit than they deserve.

Veniality, sure.  Especially for the non-Trumpists.  They have had the same objective for decades: enhance the Rich and screw the Poor.  Claim to support Small Business while throwing them under the bus in favor of Big Business.
Logged

Bruce Guttman
Solo Trombone, Hollis Town Band
Section Ldr, Merrimack Valley Philharmonic Orch.
Douglas Fur
*
Offline Offline

Location: Seola Creek, USA
Joined: Jul 4, 2014
Posts: 808

View Profile
« Reply #601 on: Jan 22, 2017, 11:06AM »

Here's what will happen: The Republicans will push through their agenda of voting suppression, tax cuts for the rich, healthcare disaster and numerous other bad ideas while they distract us with absurdities like inauguration crowd size.

The media will gladly play along because the bright shiny object is easiest to cover.

Yes. The pressure to get it done now supports this model. Is it get it done before the people catch on or get it done before Our Leader loses interest?

At what point will T-rump say "You don't love me any more. You don't deserve me." and quit?

DRB
Seola Creek
Logged
B0B
*
Offline Offline

Location:
Joined: Jun 27, 2008
Posts: 5194

View Profile
« Reply #602 on: Jan 23, 2017, 05:15AM »

Wow... and trump is off to a horrible start :( First, we walks into the CIA to try to tell them that "it's the media" and the twitter posts on his feed attacking them aren't on his twitter feed (still there btw). Then we have the actions of an incredible insecure man, questioning the crowd size and even the weather of his inauguration... two easily provable falsehoods.

http://www.shmoop.com/1984/book-1-chapter-7-quotes.html



"It was as though some huge force were pressing down upon you – something that penetrated inside your skull, battering against your brain, frightening you out of your beliefs, persuading you, almost, to deny the evidence of your senses. In the end the Party would announce that two and two made five, and you would have to believe it. It was inevitable that they should make that claim sooner or later: the logic of their position demanded it. Not merely the validity of experience, but the very existence of external reality, was tacitly denied by their philosophy. The heresy of heresies was common sense. And what was terrifying was not that they would kill you for thinking otherwise, but that they might be right. For, after all, how do we know that two and two make four? Or that the force of gravity works? Or that the past is unchangeable? If both the past and the external world exist only in the mind, and if the mind itself is controllable…what then? (1.7.27)"
http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/315527-conway-spicer-used-alternative-facts-in-press-briefing


"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command. His heart sank as he thought of the enormous power arrayed against him, the ease with which any Party intellectual would overthrow him in debate, the subtle arguments which he would not be able to understand, much less answer. And yet he was in the right! They were wrong and he was right. The obvious, the silly, and the true had got to be defended. Truisms are true, hold on to that! The solid world exists, its laws do not change. Stones are hard, water is wet, objects unsupported fall towards the earth's centre. With the feeling that he was speaking to O'Brien, and also that he was setting forth an important axiom […] (1.7.29-30)"
http://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2017/01/21/sean-spicer-entire-defends-inauguration-crowd-size-sot.cnn
Logged
robcat2075

*
Offline Offline

Location: Dallas, Texas
Joined: Apr 19, 2009
Posts: 5274

View Profile
« Reply #603 on: Jan 23, 2017, 08:22PM »

Getting to work...

Trump names his Inauguration Day a ‘National Day of Patriotic Devotion’
Logged

Robert Holmén

Hear me as I Play My Horn


Get your Popper, Dotzauer, or Kummer play-alongs!
slide advantage
*
*
Offline Offline

Location:
Joined: Apr 18, 2016
Posts: 528

View Profile WWW
« Reply #604 on: Jan 23, 2017, 08:28PM »

I'd trust Cujo the rabid St Bernard over Trump any day
Logged
robcat2075

*
Offline Offline

Location: Dallas, Texas
Joined: Apr 19, 2009
Posts: 5274

View Profile
« Reply #605 on: Jan 23, 2017, 10:36PM »

Here's an interesting commentary.  Basically, we're just three days into Trump's Presidency and we're already getting the sort of "the President is out of touch" whispers that take years to emerge for other Presidents.

Quote
The Trump White House not only leaks like crazy. It casually leaks the most intimate and humiliating details about the President - hurt feelings, ego injury, childlike behavior, self-destructive rages over tweets, media failure to credit his own grandiosity. We have simply never seen this level of leaking, with this little respect for the President's dignity or reputation, this early.

The Reagan White House managed to stay on message until Iran-Contra, about six years in. Clinton until Monica-gate.

But those were seriously damaging, self-inflicted scandals.

Trump's staff is already unraveling over crowd size numbers they didn't like. They're amateurs.


Logged

Robert Holmén

Hear me as I Play My Horn


Get your Popper, Dotzauer, or Kummer play-alongs!
elmsandr

*
Online Online

Location: Howell, MI
Joined: Apr 12, 2004
Posts: 3159

View Profile
« Reply #606 on: Jan 24, 2017, 06:54AM »

Wow... and trump is off to a horrible start :( First, we walks into the CIA to try to tell them that "it's the media" and the twitter posts on his feed attacking them aren't on his twitter feed (still there btw). Then we have the actions of an incredible insecure man, questioning the crowd size and even the weather of his inauguration... two easily provable falsehoods.

http://www.shmoop.com/1984/book-1-chapter-7-quotes.html



"It was as though some huge force were pressing down upon you – something that penetrated inside your skull, battering against your brain, frightening you out of your beliefs, persuading you, almost, to deny the evidence of your senses. In the end the Party would announce that two and two made five, and you would have to believe it. It was inevitable that they should make that claim sooner or later: the logic of their position demanded it. Not merely the validity of experience, but the very existence of external reality, was tacitly denied by their philosophy. The heresy of heresies was common sense. And what was terrifying was not that they would kill you for thinking otherwise, but that they might be right. For, after all, how do we know that two and two make four? Or that the force of gravity works? Or that the past is unchangeable? If both the past and the external world exist only in the mind, and if the mind itself is controllable…what then? (1.7.27)"
http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/315527-conway-spicer-used-alternative-facts-in-press-briefing


"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command. His heart sank as he thought of the enormous power arrayed against him, the ease with which any Party intellectual would overthrow him in debate, the subtle arguments which he would not be able to understand, much less answer. And yet he was in the right! They were wrong and he was right. The obvious, the silly, and the true had got to be defended. Truisms are true, hold on to that! The solid world exists, its laws do not change. Stones are hard, water is wet, objects unsupported fall towards the earth's centre. With the feeling that he was speaking to O'Brien, and also that he was setting forth an important axiom […] (1.7.29-30)"
http://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2017/01/21/sean-spicer-entire-defends-inauguration-crowd-size-sot.cnn

Walking back from the Orwell a bit to the more tangible... How many complaints did you see from the GOP over perceived slights to veterans?  Just look at how many complaints there were when Obama went to Japan a few weeks from major holiday.  Now, Trump goes to a CIA memorial and complains about crowd size and the media and brings a cheering section.  I'm sure we will get all those memes about disrespect and articles in NR and American Thinker about that, right? (I haven't checked yet, but my feed has a few 100% copiers of NR and AT on it and nothing so far).

Cheers,
Andy
Logged

Andrew Elms
Ellrod

*
Offline Offline

Location: North
Joined: Oct 30, 2001
Posts: 5903

View Profile
« Reply #607 on: Jan 25, 2017, 03:50PM »

News report:

"Trump continues to insist that Mexico will repay the estimated $8 billion cost of the 1,600-kilometre wall through a variety of means, including increasing fees on visa applications, charging more for border crossing cards and/or taxing remittances of Mexican Americans.


Taxing remittances of labourers making minimum wage? Jesus.
Logged
badger

*
Offline Offline

Location: Permian Basin
Joined: Sep 27, 2010
Posts: 1212

View Profile
« Reply #608 on: Jan 25, 2017, 04:04PM »

They will go North!
Logged
BGuttman
Mad Chemist

*
*
Offline Offline

Location: Londonderry, NH, USA
Joined: Dec 12, 2000
Posts: 50037
"Almost Professional"


View Profile
« Reply #609 on: Jan 25, 2017, 04:45PM »

They will go North!

Quite frankly, I think Canada would treat them a lot better than the Trumpian US.

And just imagine how the farmers and hotel owners will feel when their cheap labor disappears... Evil
Logged

Bruce Guttman
Solo Trombone, Hollis Town Band
Section Ldr, Merrimack Valley Philharmonic Orch.
elmsandr

*
Online Online

Location: Howell, MI
Joined: Apr 12, 2004
Posts: 3159

View Profile
« Reply #610 on: Jan 26, 2017, 05:41AM »

Gah.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/monkey-cage/wp/2017/01/25/we-asked-people-which-inauguration-crowd-was-bigger-heres-what-they-said/?utm_term=.a26927cc1cce

Of course, this can be seen repeatedly here.

Cheers,
Andy
Logged

Andrew Elms
Baron von Bone
Fear is the Mind-Killer.

*
Offline Offline

Location: Athens, GA (USA)
Joined: Jul 16, 2002
Posts: 17929
"Reality Junkie"


View Profile
« Reply #611 on: Jan 26, 2017, 09:38AM »


Yup ... and it needs to be called what it is.
 
We're dealing with a large number of people who are either actually able to believe things starkly contrary to clear evidence, or who are more than happy to act in every way as if they do. In either case the toxic results are the same. I hope we don't have to do worse than Trump to learn this.
 
Because one thing that's crystal clear is that these people will use a normal sense of polite propriety against us, and they have no reservations with imposing harmful utter nonsense on tremendous numbers of unwilling parties.
Logged

- Feeding a troll just gives it a platform and amplifies its voice.
 
- Science is what we have learned about how to keep from fooling ourselves.  - Richard Feynman
- He who knows not and knows not that he knows not is a fool.   - Confucius
Douglas Fur
*
Offline Offline

Location: Seola Creek, USA
Joined: Jul 4, 2014
Posts: 808

View Profile
« Reply #612 on: Jan 27, 2017, 11:18AM »


We're dealing with a large number of people who are either actually able to believe things starkly contrary to clear evidence, or who are more than happy to act in every way as if they do. In either case the toxic results are the same. I hope we don't have to do worse than Trump to learn this.

"To think the best of others", works, most of the time and thinking positively and imagining "he's just like me" usually works and it's more comforting than the constant stress of imagining you are surrounded by bad people.

There is a trend to imagine that Trump is normal and that things will be OK.

What is not being taken seriously is Trump's mental health. He is showing many markers of a serious personality disorder and people are reacting like "It's not that bad.", "You're exaggerating". or "It couldn't be that serious, look how successful he has been."

After my brother got out of prison I was given a chance to look at a synopsis of record while there. (Someone made a positive assumption about me and turned a blind eye to the privacy section of the rule book when he pushed the print button on the copy machine.)

Reading the notes written by his therapist I could see my brother had totally conned her, a professional who should be able to sort out lies and mental aberrations. Having grown up with him I'm fairly good at sorting out the lies. I can get taken in but eventually something that is not quite right comes through.

Often it's exaggeration, as if he doesn't know when to quite and runs the lie to long. It's like sticking to the "My inauguration crowd was the biggest ever." in spite of the obvious facts. This is a function of the disability in seeing the lie from another's point of view. They can't sense when someone has caught on to the lie and continue on in what looks like a self defeating manner.

Trump has had the advantage of privilege, the rich dad to bail him out and a protected environment in which he could succeed. But what is the record of his success? We have asertions that he is worth billions but the facts we have are he was worth $500million but was on the edge of bankruptcy.

My brother, on the other hand, didn't have a rich dad and didn't succeed in avoiding the drugs which Donald did. He did have some success in prison, winning a prize from the Penn writers project. His story reads in a monotone of suppressed anger. It was written in the first person and the other character is literally told to "shut up". Again imagining another's point of view was not there. The parallel in this "success story" is that both my brother and Trump, given a supportive environment, are smart enough to "pass for normal."

Another parallel is their mysogyny. Me brother was in prison for beating a woman. Trump's first wife has hinted that he was abusive to her but their divorce agreement has a gag clause so the degree of this abuse is concealed. Another advantage of privilege and a strategy learned from Roy Cohn is to avoid criminal charges and what would be revealed in court by settleing out of court and include a strong gag clause so that Trump's wrong doing is not revealed.

So what is the value of sharing this? I don't think Trump's supporters will accept it. My opinion here is speculative but I have been able to confirm my "spider sense" for the mentally ill in several other situations. It's probably easier for most of you to ignore what I say because it's easier to live your life without accepting it. Still I offer this in case it helps someone to understand what's happening when things go south. Which, I fear, is inevitable.

DRB
Seola Creek.
Logged
timothy42b
*
Offline Offline

Location: Colonial Heights, Virginia, US
Joined: Dec 7, 2000
Posts: 11701

View Profile
« Reply #613 on: Jan 27, 2017, 12:03PM »


After my brother got out of prison I was given a chance to look at a synopsis of record while there. (Someone made a positive assumption about me and turned a blind eye to the privacy section of the rule book when he pushed the print button on the copy machine.)

Reading the notes written by his therapist I could see my brother had totally conned her, a professional who should be able to sort out lies and mental aberrations.

I'm commenting only on this aspect of your post, not whether it has larger application currently.

Long ago when working in a drug treatment program I was required to read The Criminal Personality by Yochelson and Samenow.  They were psychiatrists working with the forensic population at St Elizabeth's hospital. 

They eventually came to realize they had been conned over and over themselves, and learned some lessons about how to avoid it.  They did not succeed in convincing their peers this was even possible.  They explored cognitive patterns underlying criminal behavior, occurring in both sane and insane individuals. 

Those of us who worked in the field thought there was a great deal of validity to their findings.  My colleagues in grad school were not as sold on it.  It is well worth reading, but it's 3 volumes and fairly hard going.  One of them later published a popularized version. 
Logged

Tim Richardson
mwpfoot
@mwpfoot

*
Offline Offline

Location: Oakland , CA
Joined: Sep 29, 2004
Posts: 5058
"Mark"


View Profile WWW
« Reply #614 on: Jan 27, 2017, 01:04PM »

The transcript of his recent ABC interview plainly records a mind lost in the weeds.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2017/01/26/donald-trumps-brazen-first-interview-as-president-annotated/?utm_term=.3505150a4d54

A few friends on Facebook declared it identical to personal interactions with their own parents as they aged and succumbed to dementia.

 :(
Logged

Use what talents you possess: the woods would be very silent if no birds sang there except those that sang best.
Ellrod

*
Offline Offline

Location: North
Joined: Oct 30, 2001
Posts: 5903

View Profile
« Reply #615 on: Jan 27, 2017, 01:10PM »

A friend laughed and said Trump was going to appoint his horse to the Senate.


Impossible!


Supreme Court maybe.
Logged
B0B
*
Offline Offline

Location:
Joined: Jun 27, 2008
Posts: 5194

View Profile
« Reply #616 on: Jan 27, 2017, 01:30PM »

The transcript of his recent ABC interview plainly records a mind lost in the weeds.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2017/01/26/donald-trumps-brazen-first-interview-as-president-annotated/?utm_term=.3505150a4d54

A few friends on Facebook declared it identical to personal interactions with their own parents as they aged and succumbed to dementia. :(
Might help explain why old people liked him so much...

Felt very familiar.
Logged
robcat2075

*
Offline Offline

Location: Dallas, Texas
Joined: Apr 19, 2009
Posts: 5274

View Profile
« Reply #617 on: Jan 27, 2017, 01:36PM »

The non-English-speaking world isn't really getting the full flavor of Trump speak...

‘Make America big again’? The headache of translating Trump into foreign languages.


Quote
...In Japanese, a structural challenge also exists when translating Trump’s words. Agness Kaku, a professional translator based in Tokyo who has worked for a number of politicians, said in an interview with The Post that English is a subject-prominent language — understanding a sentence in English involves pinning down who or what the subject is. Japanese, on the other hand, requires tracking the topic of a conversation.

In Trump’s remarks, Kaku said, the subject is very easy to keep track of — “it’s about him, it’s about the enemy.” But the actual topic or point of his sentences is often difficult to grasp, complicating Japanese translations. “It just drifts,” she said. “You end up having to guess as a translator, which isn’t very good. You shouldn’t have to guess.”
Logged

Robert Holmén

Hear me as I Play My Horn


Get your Popper, Dotzauer, or Kummer play-alongs!
robcat2075

*
Offline Offline

Location: Dallas, Texas
Joined: Apr 19, 2009
Posts: 5274

View Profile
« Reply #618 on: Jan 28, 2017, 12:22PM »

White House Staff Reminded To Place Lids Firmly On Trash Cans After Steve Bannon Gets Into Garbage Again

Logged

Robert Holmén

Hear me as I Play My Horn


Get your Popper, Dotzauer, or Kummer play-alongs!
Russ White

*
Online Online

Location: Orange City, Fl
Joined: Feb 27, 2007
Posts: 4999

View Profile
« Reply #619 on: Jan 28, 2017, 12:43PM »


Gotta love the Onion!!
Logged

Better than yesterday, better yet tomorrow.
Pages: 1 ... 26 27 28 29 30 [31] 32   Go Up
Print
Jump to: