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The Trombone ForumPractice BreakChit-ChatPurely Politics(Moderators: bhcordova, RedHotMama, BFW) What Trump's election means for the rest of the world
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Author Topic: What Trump's election means for the rest of the world  (Read 27401 times)
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Bimmerman
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« Reply #620 on: Nov 08, 2017, 04:40PM »

The interesting thing is that those NRA fanatics, and I use the term quite seriously, number about 3 million. Less than 1% of the total population.

I'd say a subset of the NRA member list are rabid fanatics on gun control. There are also lots of NRA members who are required to be members in order to join and use the local shooting range facilities. If you weren't an NRA member, you couldn't be a club member, so you held your nose and joined. I quit the NRA last year because I vehemently disagree with their obstructionist approach to even gun control discussions, and therefore had to give up my membership at the local gun ranges. It was an easy choice for me (racecars are way more fun) but I could see it being a much harder choice for folks who disagree with NRA dogma yet enjoy shooting enough to join a range.

So....yea. I wouldn't paint all the NRA members with the fanatic brush, although there are a LOT of their membership that it is applicable to.
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B0B
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« Reply #621 on: Nov 08, 2017, 04:47PM »

I'd say a subset of the NRA member list are rabid fanatics on gun control. There are also lots of NRA members who are required to be members in order to join and use the local shooting range facilities. If you weren't an NRA member, you couldn't be a club member, so you held your nose and joined. I quit the NRA last year because I vehemently disagree with their obstructionist approach to even gun control discussions, and therefore had to give up my membership at the local gun ranges. It was an easy choice for me (racecars are way more fun) but I could see it being a much harder choice for folks who disagree with NRA dogma yet enjoy shooting enough to join a range.

So....yea. I wouldn't paint all the NRA members with the fanatic brush, although there are a LOT of their membership that it is applicable to.

The other side... the NRA actually started as a responsible and reasonable group to train gun owners in the use of their guns. And that tradition still has roots in modern day, even if much of it has gone to political posturing.

They developed many training courses, and to this day... most concealed carry, hunting courses, and the like are
a) required by local governments in order to get licensed
b) mostly or only offered by NRA chapters in localities

which basically amounts to government sanction of the NRA and it's propaganda.

There really should be something to say that attending training by a political lobbying organization should not be a requirement in order to obtain a government license.
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robcat2075

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« Reply #622 on: Nov 08, 2017, 04:47PM »

A number like "3 Million NRA members" sounds almost democratic compared to the about 5000 richest US taxpayers the Republican tax cut bill is designed to benefit.

The NRA has pull not so much because of 3 Million members but because of the small number very wealthy members who fund its lobbying and public misinformation efforts.
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Robert Holmén

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« Reply #623 on: Nov 08, 2017, 04:48PM »

A number like "3 Million NRA members" sounds almost democratic compared to the about 5000 richest US taxpayers the Republican tax cut bill is designed to benefit.

The NRA has pull not so much because of 3 Million members but because of the small number very wealthy members who fund its lobbying and public misinformation efforts.

A very insightful discussion on their methods and influence on how they keep power...

https://www.npr.org/2017/10/05/555859571/nra-backed-gun-laws-have-found-success-in-state-legislatures-across-the-u-s
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timothy42b
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« Reply #624 on: Nov 08, 2017, 08:11PM »

The other side... the NRA actually started as a responsible and reasonable group to train gun owners in the use of their guns. And that tradition still has roots in modern day, even if much of it has gone to political posturing.

They developed many training courses, and to this day... most concealed carry, hunting courses, and the like are
a) required by local governments in order to get licensed
b) mostly or only offered by NRA chapters in localities

which basically amounts to government sanction of the NRA and it's propaganda.

There really should be something to say that attending training by a political lobbying organization should not be a requirement in order to obtain a government license.

I remember the NRA as being important to hunters and competitive target shooters.

During my lifetime the percentage of people who hunt has dropped from 10 to 6%.  I couldn't find numbers on target shooting, but with the development in areas that were once rural, it must be very hard to find ranges long enough to support rifle competition. 
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Tim Richardson
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« Reply #625 on: Nov 08, 2017, 08:40PM »

It may be that no one really knows how many NRA members there are.  They have so many different levels of membership that their annual tax statements give only a rough guide of ups an downs.

They go up after a prominent massacre then trail off agian.


New NRA Tax Filing Shows Membership Revenues Dropped by $47 Million Following Sandy Hook Surge
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Robert Holmén

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Baron von Bone
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« Reply #626 on: Nov 09, 2017, 05:03AM »

The other side... the NRA actually started as a responsible and reasonable group to train gun owners in the use of their guns. And that tradition still has roots in modern day, even if much of it has gone to political posturing.
 
They developed many training courses, and to this day... most concealed carry, hunting courses, and the like are
a) required by local governments in order to get licensed
b) mostly or only offered by NRA chapters in localities
 
which basically amounts to government sanction of the NRA and it's propaganda.
 
There really should be something to say that attending training by a political lobbying organization should not be a requirement in order to obtain a government license.

Yup ... initially as American as the Boy Scouts and Apple Pie (which should of course be capitalized in this context--it's representing America, which is why kneeling while eating it is highly disrespectful to the flag, and of course veterans).
 
But the NRA is now all about using the social and psychological tactics of authoritarian religion to suppress sober thinking and feed the gun industry, and they're very good at it, wildly successful. Every news brief is about the most dire emergency gun owners and lovers of freedom and all American Values and our sacred way of life have ever faced! And the threat is to our fundamental freedom and even ability to keep and bear arms, the most sacred of civil liberties (because if you can't defend yourself and you're killed you obviously loose any and all rights along with absolutely everything else in your life--it's a pretty compelling argument when considered as a rhetorical island, and that's how such institutions function in terms of ideology--a kernel of truth is key to the most effective deceptions and manipulations). The standard response to any such news brief, of course, is to buy up as much of the "threatened" goods as you can fit into your budget ... Got to do it now, before it's too late and you'll never have the chance again! Never mind that it's never worked out that way before, for any of the many many most dire emergencies gun owners and lovers of freedom and all American Values and our sacred way of life have ever faced!.
 
But they're an overall good organization of course ...
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« Reply #627 on: Nov 09, 2017, 08:23PM »

From the [Manchester] Guardian:

“Trump was a loser in whichever direction you looked this week, both at home and abroad. As a candidate, Trump bragged about all the lessons he would teach China once he was president. He would stop China from “raping” the US economy and “toying” with the US over North Korea. He would bring trade cases against China in the US courts, slap heavy tariffs on Chinese goods and stop China manipulating its currency. He would ramp up the US military presence in the Asia-Pacific region. He might even renege on the holy of holies in Sino-American relations for the past 40 years – the One China doctrine that says Taiwan is a part of China, not a separate country.


Contrast that assertive Trump with the deflated one who made a joint appearance with Xi Jinping in Beijing on Thursday, as part of his five-nation Asian tour. In every respect, Trump’s script was so anodyne, and his conduct so docile, that they could have been drafted and prescribed by Xi himself. There were no threats on trade, no military posturing, and no mention of Taiwan or challenge to the One China policy.
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