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Author Topic: "Useful idiots"?  (Read 1158 times)
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Russ White

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« on: Dec 11, 2016, 04:39AM »

It was a different Vladimir who, a long time ago, coined the phrase, but today's Vladimir seems to have made it work. He has installed his puppet in the White House, and is set to have one of his best friends at the head of the State Dept. When will someone in the leadership of the GOP have their David Niven/ Bridge Over the River Kwai moment? "Oh my God, what have we done?", and will it be too late?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/trump-cia-on-collision-course-over-russias-role-in-us-election/2016/12/10/ad01556c-bf01-11e6-91ee-1adddfe36cbe_story.html?utm_term=.f5b009a0c940

http://www.npr.org/sections/parallels/2016/12/08/504737811/russia-seen-moving-new-missiles-to-eastern-europe
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BGuttman
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« Reply #1 on: Dec 11, 2016, 08:25AM »

When he does, the amount of lashing out will be terrible to perceive.

Now the question becomes will he support measures that would prevent somebody like him from being elected?

Then again, he probably will simply glide on thinking that it's the next guy who needs to be curtailed (i.e. he's not a problem -- he's never  a problem).
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Russ White

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« Reply #2 on: Dec 11, 2016, 09:28AM »

It's not him that needs to wake the frak up, it's the rest of the GOP that are just blindly getting in line. At least we're seeing Graham and McCain speaking up.
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« Reply #3 on: Dec 11, 2016, 11:12AM »

You guys do realize that he hasn't taken office yet? Right?
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« Reply #4 on: Dec 11, 2016, 11:29AM »

Speaking of useful idiots ... reflexively changing the subject when the subject is inconvenient is one of the stronger identifiers.
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« Reply #5 on: Dec 11, 2016, 11:50AM »

Speaking of useful idiots ... reflexively changing the subject when the subject is inconvenient is one of the stronger identifiers.

So, then, You're NOT aware that he hasn't taken office yet.  Evil
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« Reply #6 on: Dec 11, 2016, 11:57AM »

"The New York Times quoted a senior administration officials as saying there was "high confidence" that the Russians hacked both the Democratic and Republican National Committees, but leaked only documents damaging to Clinton through WikiLeaks."

"High Confidence" is not exactly facts, but with dimwit democrats, who were lead by "what difference does it make" Hillary, you can't really be surprised by them believing in the WsshPo story anyway.

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« Reply #7 on: Dec 11, 2016, 11:59AM »

You guys do realize that he hasn't taken office yet? Right?

You're telling us he might not?

For practical purposes, aside from a few last minute pardons and wildlife refuge declarations, the Obama administration is concluded and everything policy and security emanates from Trump now.

So, yes, the Russian's preferred candidate is installed.


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« Reply #8 on: Dec 11, 2016, 01:48PM »

I think Obama's requirement that the CIA report on election interference be on his desk before he exits is hardly a 'wildlife refuge' type matter, especially if it goes further than has so far been indicated. Evil I think that report does have the potential to upset his accession to the Presidency.

Or rather, I wish it would because I feel very sorry for Americans. And very afraid for the whole world, with an idiot like Trump sitting with his finger on the button. :-0 Horrors!

Not to mention the fact that, far from the US becoming great again, all respect for Americans by the rest of the world is fast disappearing.     
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« Reply #9 on: Dec 11, 2016, 05:39PM »

...wildlife refuge declarations...



One in Manhattan, hopefully. Great band.
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robcat2075

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« Reply #10 on: Dec 11, 2016, 07:18PM »

Useful idiots?

No, I think Trump et al. are fully-aware conspirators. They don't believe in democracy or freedoms or equality or any of that American stuff. They believe in whatever will make them a buck and whatever will destroy anyone who disagrees with them. Winning is their only metric.





I think Obama's requirement that the CIA report on election interference be on his desk before he exits is hardly a 'wildlife refuge' type matter, especially if it goes further than has so far been indicated. Evil I think that report does have the potential to upset his accession to the Presidency...     


The CIA report will be just that... a report.  It will find that the Russians supported a mildly veiled propaganda campaign to advantage their preferred candidate. It's alarming but... that's what the US has been doing in other countries, including Russia, ever since WWII, at least.

It probably will not find that Trump got any campaign contributions from Russia, that would be illegal.

It probably will not find that anyone in the Trump campaign actively communicated with Russia to do request their help, that might not even be illegal anyway.

It won't change anything. Even if it directly implicates Donald Trump it won't matter because none of his supporters nor the GOP-controlled Congress will care.



I'll note that once Congress counts the Electoral votes in early January, that's it.  There's no court action or recounts to undo the election after that.

That was made clear during the birther lawsuits. Congress and not the courts is the final judge of the propriety of the Presidential election and all disputes of birth place, citizenship, unfair tactics, improper foreign intervention... those all die once Congress accepts the votes as valid and counts them.


The only remaining avenue after that to remove a President is impeachment and conviction by Congress.
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« Reply #11 on: Dec 11, 2016, 07:41PM »

You guys do realize that he hasn't taken office yet? Right?

There's no 'you guys'. Just you and smart people.

Trump is making decisions that will affect his incipient governance, prior to his inauguration. Are those decisions beyond legitimate criticism from those he plans to govern, and for whom he works?
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« Reply #12 on: Dec 11, 2016, 08:22PM »

“We can’t let this happen. We should march on Washington and stop this travesty. Our nation is totally divided.”

Donald Trump in 2012 after Barack Obama was re-elected.


Donald Trump only likes fair play if he wins and if he doesn't win "it wasn't fair!"

Rules and truth will all fall by the wayside over the next four years.
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« Reply #13 on: Dec 11, 2016, 08:51PM »

I really wouldn't have minded this kind of awareness in here a decade ago. It's nice to see it now of course, but it's hard to imagine how it could have been so illusive for so long for so many. But then most of that then was about its obvious connection to far right religious thinking, and I'm actually not so sure very many are ready to recognize that little hitch even now, which is really pretty amazing.
 
Just an aside there.
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« Reply #14 on: Dec 12, 2016, 05:57AM »

Useful idiots?

No, I think Trump et al. are fully-aware conspirators. They don't believe in democracy or freedoms or equality or any of that American stuff. They believe in whatever will make them a buck and whatever will destroy anyone who disagrees with them. Winning is their only metric.


It's not Trump and his amoral, ends justify the means folks with situational (at best) ethics I was talking about. The "useful idiots" are those who elected him.
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« Reply #15 on: Dec 12, 2016, 03:43PM »

The "useful idiots" are those who elected him.

Take a DEEP BREATH and turn away from the mirror, you are looking at yourself.
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BGuttman
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« Reply #16 on: Dec 12, 2016, 04:43PM »

Take a DEEP BREATH and turn away from the mirror, you are looking at yourself.

I beg to differ.  Russ certainly did not vote for Trump.

But I'll bet you are looking forward to his "Drill, Baby Drill" policies.  Hope you have a boat. Evil
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« Reply #17 on: Dec 12, 2016, 05:12PM »

It's not Trump and his amoral, ends justify the means folks with situational (at best) ethics I was talking about. The "useful idiots" are those who elected him.

Arguable, but I'd say Trump may well be a useful idiot for Russia to some significant extent, and while all who voted for Trump can be accused of foolishness to some extent, many, perhaps most at least knew they were taking that risk (they recognized Trump's "merits" but chose to vote for him anyway, or rather against Clinton). The undeniable useful idiots are those who are intellectually compromised enough to actually believe his campaign rhetoric or who are actually dense enough to think he's a good candidate/will make a good president, particularly those who are talented enough with self-deception that they can actually manage a perceptual state in which they don't recognize any significant developing problems. Those people are The Problem we're all dealing with now.
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« Reply #18 on: Dec 20, 2016, 08:52AM »

Here's one that will shock absolutely no one who's been paying attention while commanding functional powers of observation.
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BGuttman
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« Reply #19 on: Dec 20, 2016, 09:22AM »

But they aren't going to believe this guy either.  Remember, they believe all the stuff he put up, regardless of whether it's true or not.
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