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Author Topic: GOP Health Care  (Read 2922 times)
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robcat2075

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« Reply #140 on: Mar 24, 2017, 10:11PM »

I haven't completely fact-checked this account...

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Robert Holmén

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BGuttman
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« Reply #141 on: Mar 25, 2017, 05:20AM »

That sounds like something from The Onion.

I don't doubt that Ryan will take the fall -- Trump never loses (it's always somebody else's fault).

Someone on NPR suggested that the 50-some votes to repeal Obamacare during Obama's administration were easy since it was symbolic -- Obama would veto any bill that landed on his desk.  But now with a President who would sign such a bill, the Republicans got cold feet.
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Baron von Bone
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« Reply #142 on: Mar 25, 2017, 08:34AM »

That sounds like something from The Onion.

Or one of the many "news" bits that spread through networks of far right wing emailers and become part of the far right's understanding of reality and the basis for their judgments, their understanding of our government and our history, and their voting.
 
 
 
I don't doubt that Ryan will take the fall -- Trump never loses (it's always somebody else's fault).

In some circles, but The Donald only enjoys the freedom from responsibility or the constraints of honesty in those circles. No one else makes anywhere near the effort required in terms of self-deception and intellectual cowardice to function so stupidly.
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« Reply #143 on: Mar 25, 2017, 10:32AM »

His supporters never seem to notice when he lies. When he campaigned he claimed to have a plan that was much better and cheaper than Obamacare, and everyone would be covered. He said this many times.

How do you square that with the new behind-the-scenes line, which seems to be that he trusted Ryan to come up with a plan and it wasn't a good one?  You can't. He lied in the first place about having a plan. He was just saying what people wanted to hear.

After eight years of just relentlessly screwing with Obama, the GOP has forgotten how to actually govern, and the president is a joke. He has no idea how to preside and no interest in learning it. The one skill that people attributed to him who voted for him is his negotiating skills. He brought those out in full force, against allies, not adversaries, and fell on his face.
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Ellrod

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« Reply #144 on: Mar 25, 2017, 10:42AM »

Trump's negotiation skills are probably overrated.

It's pretty easy to negotiate from a position of strength where there's an imbalance of power. But in a checks and balance system, it's a different ball game. Trump's ultimatum probably lost him as many votes as it got him. Most people don't like being pushed around.
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« Reply #145 on: Mar 25, 2017, 10:52AM »

Trump's negotiation skills are probably overrated.

It's pretty easy to negotiate from a position of strength where there's an imbalance of power. But in a checks and balance system, it's a different ball game. Trump's ultimatum probably lost him as many votes as it got him. Most people don't like being pushed around.

His negotiating skills are plainly overrated. He bragged that he was going to cut a great deal with pharma, including negotiating lower prices on medications. He met with pharma leaders and they ate his lunch.

He has a record of cutting terrible deals. He overpaid for the Plaza Hotel, spent way to much on it, then his creditors took it from him and had to sell it for a loss. He couldn't negotiate traditional loans for his casinos, so he borrowed through junk bonds at 14%, guaranteeing that they'd fail from day one. His negotiating skills are simply one more thing he's bragged about until gullible people believed him. They certainly haven't been in evidence during his presidency.

I think the 'make-or-break' vote demand was a political gambit. It put an end to an episode that was highlighting his incompetence day after day. He was trying to separate himself, with an insouciant manner that implied, "Hey, this is their deal--do it or don't." The fact that it went down in flames didn't matter to him, because he never had any real concern over anyone's insurance in the first place.
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"What gets us into trouble is not what we don't know, it's what we know for sure that just ain't so." --Mark Twain
elmsandr

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« Reply #146 on: Mar 25, 2017, 06:05PM »

Hey... what if all those years of screaming about Obamacare... the disagreement wasn't actually about the policies.

What if there was something else.

Nah, that couldn't be,
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« Reply #147 on: Mar 25, 2017, 06:22PM »

I think if Trump had just presented the public demeanor of an adult since the election rather than that of a petty, vindictive Hollywood studio exec he would have been in a way better bargaining and influencing position for all of this.

It would have been so easy to do for anyone else.

It's not like he started a phony war in Iraq or anything but somehow he's made himself more unpopular than even George W. Bush just with a twitter account.

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Robert Holmén

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