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Author Topic: Shires or Edwards valve on bach horn  (Read 978 times)
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Emisaumell

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« on: Mar 08, 2017, 07:30PM »

Can i buy a cheap used valve section for these horns and stick them on my bach 42?
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BillO
A trombone is not measured by it's name.

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« Reply #1 on: Mar 08, 2017, 09:50PM »

Can i buy a cheap used valve section for these horns and stick them on my bach 42?
Used, yes.  Cheap ... not so sure.  As for sticking it to your Bach 42, better ask your available techs to see if they want the job.  Anything is possible wit the right talent and wallet.
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Emisaumell

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« Reply #2 on: Mar 08, 2017, 10:01PM »

I was thinking maybe a brand new valve and tubing plus everything is more costly than just buying a used valve and tubing
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Matt K

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« Reply #3 on: Mar 09, 2017, 03:34AM »

I did this with a Shires rotary. I had it installed on a straight 42 and was very pleased with the results. You may also wish to consider keeping your tubing and installing an aftermarket rotor such as a rotax. This conversion seems to be quite popular and if your tech knows what they're doing, can make sure your existing tubing is assembled well and free of burrs.
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What's in a name? that which we call a tenor-bass posaune
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pedrombon

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« Reply #4 on: Mar 09, 2017, 07:43AM »

The Rotax valve works amazing on 42 horns, but it will be even better if you also replace the stock neckpipe for a Brad Close/Brass Medic open neckpipe.
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elmsandr

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« Reply #5 on: Mar 09, 2017, 07:49AM »

You can get a new OE Thayer valve section and tubing for what, $600?  Used Shires sections are ~$1000+.  Edwards are similar, maybe a little less.

I've done this twice on a bass, I have two Shires Trubore Sections that I adapted to a Bach Bass.  I wouldn't describe it as cost effective, but it was specifically something that I wanted based on some research and development.

Cheers,
Andy
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Andrew Elms
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« Reply #6 on: Mar 09, 2017, 10:45AM »

If you have a straight bach 42, why not just trade it in for a 42BO? Also the 42 won't respond the same once you put a valve on it. Usually that also involves moving the forward bell mounting point.
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David Sullivan
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Emisaumell

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« Reply #7 on: Mar 09, 2017, 11:19AM »

I have a 42b, and the valve is almost unusable sometimes, id also really like to make the horn be able to accepy edwards or shires parts
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BGuttman
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« Reply #8 on: Mar 09, 2017, 11:32AM »

I have a 42b, and the valve is almost unusable sometimes, id also really like to make the horn be able to accepy edwards or shires parts

It's probably going to cost you almost as much as just buying an Edwards or Shires in the first place (especially a Shires Q).

What makes it unusable?  Maybe it's simply a problem that a proper repair job can fix.  We've played on Bach 42B's for a LONG time and managed to get some good notes out of them.
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Bruce Guttman
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Emisaumell

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« Reply #9 on: Mar 09, 2017, 11:34AM »

I really dont like the closed wrap, just doesnt blow right sometimes
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BGuttman
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« Reply #10 on: Mar 09, 2017, 11:46AM »

Is it possible that the rotor is misaligned?  Often that can make the valve more stuffy than normal.

Also, try squirting a little valve oil (the trumpet stuff is good for this) into the valve and see if it plays a little better.  The valve oil will improve the seal (but only temporarily).

You may find that a new valve doesn't do all you expect it to, especially if you aren't playing the valve side properly.
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Bruce Guttman
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elmsandr

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« Reply #11 on: Mar 09, 2017, 12:53PM »

I really dont like the closed wrap, just doesnt blow right sometimes
From having changed quite a few, it isn't the shape of the wrap that is the problem.  It may be the assembly of it, but the shape of a closed wrap isn't the fault. Valve might be the issue, or it might not as well.

Cheers,
Andy
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Andrew Elms
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« Reply #12 on: Mar 09, 2017, 12:58PM »

From having changed quite a few, it isn't the shape of the wrap that is the problem.  It may be the assembly of it, but the shape of a closed wrap isn't the fault. Valve might be the issue, or it might not as well.

Cheers,
Andy

Ditto. The Courtouis closed wraps horns are superb instruments. My hyothesis the reason that the open wrapped Bach horns may well play better but it's not because of the wrap per there are fewer solders involved so less of a chance for a burr or misalignment to occur. 
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What's in a name? that which we call a tenor-bass posaune
By any other name would smell as sweet;
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