Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length

 
Advanced search

1088748 Posts in 71958 Topics- by 19317 Members - Latest Member: Whitewolf07
Jump to:  
The Trombone ForumPractice BreakChit-Chat(Moderators: bhcordova, RedHotMama, BFW) Anyone Else Into Animation?
Pages: 1 2 [All]   Go Down
Print
Author Topic: Anyone Else Into Animation?  (Read 1232 times)
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
harrison.t.reed
*
Offline Offline

Location: Colorado
Joined: Apr 5, 2007
Posts: 2757
"Spartan Brass Band!"


View Profile
« on: May 02, 2017, 10:32AM »

My wife and I are huge animation fans. The classic Disney movies, Hey Arnold!, Spongebob, Animanics, Tim Burton's stop animation, and shorts like "Paperman". Pretty much anything that looks 2D and either has a great story or is funny or looks beautiful -- we are fans. America appears to have all but given up on the 2D style, which is why Paperman was so awesome -- it was computer drafted but mimicked a cel-animation style. To me, at least, there is something about 2D cel animation that even the best Pixar animation can't do. And yeah, I do think The Incredibles, Toy Story, and Finding Nemo are excellent. But for every 'Incredibles' there are 50 really terrible 3D CGI movies that are turds. There are probably even more horrible 2D cartoons for every "Beauty and the Beast", but when you compare the very best 2D animation to the very best 3D animation ... I don't know. The 2D wins.

Enter Japan. When I was a kid I saw a movie on TV called "Robot Carnival". It was an attempt by that station to introduce what they called "Japanimation" to the US. It must've been 1994 or 1995. As a kid, I loved "Tailspin", "Batman", and "Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles". Those were great examples of animation and quality in my mind. But then I saw "Robot Carnival". Think about the shows I mentioned, then watch this clip:

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x7gn4a_presence_shortfilms

The subtitles are horrible, but the dialogue actually doesn't impact the short. It's basically Pygmalion with a robot.

Having only been exposed to american kid cartoons, I remember having this reaction:

 :-0

So, I saw that before the internet was available to me, so I only knew about Otomo Katsuhiro from Robot Carnival at that time, but I soon learned about Miyazaki Hayao as well, and saw Kiki's Delivery Service and Laputa. Compared to Disney movies, the Miyazaki films seemed far more interesting and they also tackled more down to earth concepts in their stories. I had heard about a movie by Otomo called "Akira" which was supposedly the greatest example of cel animation of all time, although I was never able to see it until well after it was finally released on DVD in the USA, in 2001. This was to be a common theme for Japanese animation when I was interested in it initially. Hear about something awesome from a friend, can't find out anything about it (no useful internet until about '97), and later on can't get it -- DVD wasn't really feasible until about 2003 and VHS releases were awful because they were dubbed (yuck) by the same tiny group of people who translated the material with zero budget. Being a talented voice actor and having a knack for Japanese usually don't go hand in hand.

So, I was met with the most fantastic looking animation I had ever seen in a film that contained almost no dialogue and was known as the Japanese Fantasia (Robot Carnival) in 1994. I was then unable to see any further animation from Japan without it being either highly edited by Disney  (turning alchohol / blood into milk, covering up foreign writing, etc), or highly edited by whoever else (audio dubbed over) unless it was somebody's bootleg subtitled version until around 2003.

All the while, American animation was falling apart and we got movies like Hercules.

There was one or two exports from Japan that were heavily marketed to the US during this time period, and I actually think that these exports did not help animation in the US or help to create a respected image of Japanese animation here either. I'm talking about Pokemon. For nearly a decade, this episodic show that existed only to sell products was what 99% of Americans were exposed to and what they still think of as "Anime". It's really kind of sad.

During the late 80s, animated TV shows in Japan started taking on a mini series type format. You get 26 episodes, sometimes as few as 11, sometimes a lot more, and you tell a complete story from beginning to end with those episodes. That's right, most Japanese cartoons have an ending. This is still pretty much unheard of in the US. So, while Animaniacs was plugging along, studios in Japan were producing shows with feature film music, professional voice actors, and complete stories like "Escaflowne", "Neon Genesis Evangelion" and "Trigun". Not into action? Well, you could have seen "His and Her Circumstances" or "Great Teacher Onizuka". All of these shows looked great, sounded great, and told great stories.

DVDs finally opened up the potential for animation, and not just from Japan. Now the original audio with subtitles could be offered as an option along with English audio. People with an interest in animation could now be targeted specifically through the DVD format, rather than trying to put together a TV version that the stations would air. A lot of French animation is now available in the US, and Persepolis is an outstanding example of this.

It's ironic that as DVDs and the internet now made cel-style animation widely available from around the world, cel-style animation in the US has all but died and story driven cartoons have never caught on. The closest the US came was the attempt to copy Japan with "The Last Air Bender" (which was HUGELY popular with kids, and was sort of story driven).

So ... what gives? Am I a rare breed? Should cartoons just be low budget stuff to keep kids happy, or can it be art that is appreciated by adults too? Anyone else think France and Japan are doing something cool? Otomo? Miyazaki?
Logged

"My technique is as good as Initial D"
T-396A - Griego 1C
88HTCL - Griego 1C
36H - DE XT105, C+, D Alto Shank
3B/F Silversonic - Griego 1A ss
pBone (with Yellow bell for bright tone)
harrison.t.reed
*
Offline Offline

Location: Colorado
Joined: Apr 5, 2007
Posts: 2757
"Spartan Brass Band!"


View Profile
« Reply #1 on: May 02, 2017, 10:55AM »

And I know my post was pretty Japan heavy, but maybe someone else has heard of good animation coming out in the states that isn't Pixar?

I think an ex-Disney traditional animator did a series called "Bitey of Brackenwood" entirely in flash. It's outstanding.

If I had the talent, I'd animate something cel-style in flash to go with "Motorbike Concerto".
Logged

"My technique is as good as Initial D"
T-396A - Griego 1C
88HTCL - Griego 1C
36H - DE XT105, C+, D Alto Shank
3B/F Silversonic - Griego 1A ss
pBone (with Yellow bell for bright tone)
robcat2075

*
Offline Offline

Location: Dallas, Texas
Joined: Apr 19, 2009
Posts: 6411

View Profile
« Reply #2 on: May 02, 2017, 11:24AM »

I love animation.  Or at least I did.  I had a career in corporate animation and got into real character animation as an enthusiast after that and even went to animation school to learn more about it.

I loved the 2D "second golden age" that began somewhere around "Little Mermaid" and died somewhere around "Treasure Planet."

I was excited by the new 3D style beginning with Pixar in the 90s. I loved almost every Pixar movie until... "Cars 2". That killed it for me.  It all seems just too slick now and too much of a 90 minute toy commercial.

Quote
Should cartoons just be low budget stuff to keep kids happy, or can it be art that is appreciated by adults too?

One reason I haven't pursued it since animation school is that almost all the work is just kid stuff done on sweatshop schedules. Pixar level jobs are more competitive than symphony orchestra seats.  You're more likely to get a job playing basketball in the NBA than as an animator on a theatrical feature in the US. One year, Dreamworks got 9000 applications for less than 10 openings.  Amazed


But for you, the audience... It will never be serious adult stuff except for small niches of fans.

I say that because, in 30 years of closely following the animation scene, I have never (NEVER!) encountered an adult in person, other than someone who already works in animation, who will mention having seen an animated film without the cover story of having gone to it because they took their kids.

It may be big business, it may sell lots of toys and pajamas and lunch boxes but it just isn't something that is a priority for regular adults to put thoughtful time on. And because of that, animated features are generally designed as a safe G to PG-rated entertainments that fretful soccer moms can take their kids to and not have to worry about what will show up on screen.

The Disney animators, from Walt himself all the way up to Glen Keane,  were always fantasizing about doing serious, quality adult things but never found a way to make money at it.


2D animation is great, but you have to be a total drawing beast to do it. One of my animation teachers, who had been on both 2D and 3D projects at Dreamworks said, "3D saved my career, I really couldn't draw well enough for 2D."  :D

3D lends itself to a production pipeline of easier-to-segment talent even more than 2D did.

Also, the general population is far more comfortable with the realistic appearance of 3D vs. the artistic styling of 2D art.

It will take some dramatic reset of our civilization for all of this to change.

Logged

Robert Holmén

Hear me as I Play My Horn


Get your Popper, Dotzauer, or Kummer play-alongs!
harrison.t.reed
*
Offline Offline

Location: Colorado
Joined: Apr 5, 2007
Posts: 2757
"Spartan Brass Band!"


View Profile
« Reply #3 on: May 02, 2017, 12:47PM »

Bummer. I guess that's why I mentioned Akira. Definitely a hard "R" rating. But the story falls FAR short of, say, "Whisper of the Heart" or Toy Story.

Another adult cartoon would be "Ghost in the Shell", which DOES have a decent plot and is also a hard "R".

Akira and Ghost in the Shell were both monstrous cash cows internationally. To the point that GITS is now a live action US movie???

I guess it's just in the States that the medium is perceived so poorly?
Logged

"My technique is as good as Initial D"
T-396A - Griego 1C
88HTCL - Griego 1C
36H - DE XT105, C+, D Alto Shank
3B/F Silversonic - Griego 1A ss
pBone (with Yellow bell for bright tone)
robcat2075

*
Offline Offline

Location: Dallas, Texas
Joined: Apr 19, 2009
Posts: 6411

View Profile
« Reply #4 on: May 02, 2017, 01:52PM »

One of my animation friends was in the military and stationed in Japan for quite a few years. He noted that anime isn't as wildly popular in Japan as American enthusiasts often claim.

Yes, it has its fans, it shows up on TV and sometimes a movie will do very well there, but it's not the national pastime. An adult who is seriously into it is regarded much the same way that fanboys are here.


I think anime had an entrée here in the States during the 70s-80s because it was so much unlike the classic Disney product that everyone was tired of, and that difference appealed to a certain segment. (Most people here aren't old enough to remember when the "Disney" brand meant 'sugary kids movie'. I'm still amazed they were able to turn that around. :D )

I've generally liked the Studio Ghibili efforts like Tortoro and Fireflies but some of their style conventions are painful once you notice them. For example, their dialog animation seems to have just a couple of mouth shapes... closed and scream.  Yeah, RIGHT.

A lot of TV anime makes me feel like there's a comic book somewhere I needed to read first to know what's going on.

"Cowboy Bebop" is good.  One of the few series that I wanted to see more episodes of.
Logged

Robert Holmén

Hear me as I Play My Horn


Get your Popper, Dotzauer, or Kummer play-alongs!
JohnL
Edge Monster

*
Offline Offline

Location: Anaheim, CA, USA
Joined: Aug 1, 2004
Posts: 7228

View Profile WWW
« Reply #5 on: May 02, 2017, 01:59PM »

I guess it's just in the States that the medium is perceived so poorly?
More so than in Asia (particularly in Japan), certainly - although (as Robert pointed out) anime and related media is still something of a niche market.

Somewhere along the line, animation in the US became a "just for kids" sort of thing. Maybe it had to do with the Hays Code; some pre-code shorts I've seen were pretty out there. Just look at the pre-code Betty Boop vs. the "code-friendly" version from a few years later.

I grew up on the uncut Looney Tunes/Merrie Melodies shorts. At five, it was just slapstick, with colors, noise, and motion. Years later, I would go back and watch the same short and see all of the subtle stuff they snuck in - it was like watching a whole new cartoon.

Disney has turned out a few animated projects that weren't quite as kid-friendly. The Black Cauldron comes to mind, along with Gargoyles (seasons 1 and 2, in particular).

I think anime had an entrée here in the States during the 70s-80s because it was so much unlike the classic Disney product that everyone was tired of, and that difference appealed to a certain segment. (Most people here aren't old enough to remember when the "Disney" brand meant 'sugary kids movie'.
Seemed to me to be mostly the college age/young adult crowd, but that may have just been my perception at the time.
Logged

Question change.
Embrace progress.
Take the time to learn the difference.
bigbassbone1

*
Offline Offline

Location: Los Angeles, CA
Joined: Sep 7, 2012
Posts: 972

View Profile
« Reply #6 on: May 02, 2017, 02:23PM »

I really dont know much about the process and definitely haven't thought about it as much as yourself, but I LOVE animation stuff.

I remember  (so many years ago now...) being on a music canp as a thirteen year old, and switching on my hotel TV late at night. We have a channel in Australia that kind of specialises in international shows, and by chance they had the neon genesis evangelion film playing. As a 13 year old I didn't understand everything I was watching, but boy was it captivating! I stayed up late watching the whole film with my jaw on the floor.

After that I specifically sought out similar Japanese anime stuff. I will admit, that part of what attracted me as a teenager is the old classic of the super violence in these shows, some of them get very full on. Elfen Lied springs to mind in terms of violence, but also a very captivating story.
A short while ago I was discussing with my girlfriend about how good this stuff was. She was very unsure, we have both been adults for quite some time, and I think she saw it as a bit of a kids thing but also, kinda geeky or nerdy I guess, i dunno. I thought I would pit on one for her that had an incredible story, and whilst it has now become very mainstream and part of pop culture, I seriously think that "Death Note" has one of the best stories I have ever seen. My girlfriend was hooked after 2 episodes, and it really makes you want to keep watching the whole way through.

There are less American cartoon or animated things I like, but there is definitely some quality stuff. The best one that springs to my mind is "Daria" from th 90's. It was extremely funny but at least for me (of course in an exaggerated way) really captured a lot of character stereo types perfectly. Even though Daria was seemingly a boring character I loved watching her develop and interact with the world around her. Its probably time for a live action Daria film actually.....
Logged
jalapeno

*
Offline Offline

Location: San Antonio
Joined: Feb 6, 2014
Posts: 570

View Profile
« Reply #7 on: May 02, 2017, 03:13PM »

I used to watch a bunch of anime, starting with Dragon Ball Z in the 90s. never got into pokemon but I had the gameboy game. very fun and catchy music.

Another favorite was Gundam Wing, followed by Gundam Seed.

Trigun was good....Vash was a good character.

After watching the Gunslinger Girl intro song by The Delgados "the light before we land," I bought the album HATE. it's very good.

I have probably a lot of episodes to finish out the Naruto Shippuden series.

non-Japanese I was really into Spawn comics, even the corny live-action movie. The animated Spawn was very cool. I have the dvds somewhere.

Rick and Morty on I think cartoon network is funny.

when I was in Japan, there's a section of Tokyo I visited pretty much catering to all the geek/nerd stuff. I think those kinds of people are called Otaku. That kind of thing is trending here in the US, what with all the Comic-cons happening seemingly everywhere.
Logged

Marmalade
harrison.t.reed
*
Offline Offline

Location: Colorado
Joined: Apr 5, 2007
Posts: 2757
"Spartan Brass Band!"


View Profile
« Reply #8 on: May 02, 2017, 04:31PM »

I agree that in Japan, outside of Akibahara, anime is indeed a niche. Anime Otaku are pretty heavily despised. There's a show called "Welcome to the NHK" that explores the hikikimori phenomenon and all different types of Otaku. It's a very depressing show.

On the flip side, there's definitely more going on in animation all around in Japan, despite it being a weird sub-culture.

Deathnote was really good until the halfway point. It was very faithful to the comic but that might actually be a flaw.

The best anime going recently is called "Fullmetal Alchemist". Both versions are outstanding. Also Steins;Gate.

As for Daria, I love that show! Another example of an American cartoon that attempted to have a non-episodic storyline. One of the very few. And it had a pretty terrible group of animators on an awful budget.

One of the best quotes of all TV:

"Sushi SUCKS! Saké ROCKS!" Is from that show.
Logged

"My technique is as good as Initial D"
T-396A - Griego 1C
88HTCL - Griego 1C
36H - DE XT105, C+, D Alto Shank
3B/F Silversonic - Griego 1A ss
pBone (with Yellow bell for bright tone)
robcat2075

*
Offline Offline

Location: Dallas, Texas
Joined: Apr 19, 2009
Posts: 6411

View Profile
« Reply #9 on: May 02, 2017, 06:06PM »

Another annoyance: When someone in anime is walking away from the camera, they walk like their ankles are handcuffed together.
Logged

Robert Holmén

Hear me as I Play My Horn


Get your Popper, Dotzauer, or Kummer play-alongs!
bigbassbone1

*
Offline Offline

Location: Los Angeles, CA
Joined: Sep 7, 2012
Posts: 972

View Profile
« Reply #10 on: May 02, 2017, 06:21PM »

I agree that in Japan, outside of Akibahara, anime is indeed a niche. Anime Otaku are pretty heavily despised. There's a show called "Welcome to the NHK" that explores the hikikimori phenomenon and all different types of Otaku. It's a very depressing show.

On the flip side, there's definitely more going on in animation all around in Japan, despite it being a weird sub-culture.

Deathnote was really good until the halfway point. It was very faithful to the comic but that might actually be a flaw.

The best anime going recently is called "Fullmetal Alchemist". Both versions are outstanding. Also Steins;Gate.

As for Daria, I love that show! Another example of an American cartoon that attempted to have a non-episodic storyline. One of the very few. And it had a pretty terrible group of animators on an awful budget.

One of the best quotes of all TV:

"Sushi SUCKS! Saké ROCKS!" Is from that show.

You're standing on my neck..... haha!!!!

Yeah agreed about death note. My girlfriend was almost in tears at the halfway point  :D its an emotional scene.

Oh man yeah I forgot about full metal alchemist. I watched the whole thing as a teenager but actually only saw the new story ark version a few months ago. Whilst I enjoyed the new one, i honestly think the old one was better. The new one definitely had a better flow to the story and I appreciated there were no "garbage" side story joke episodes which seemed pointless in the original. However, I think the big reveal moments of pivital plot had MUCH more impact in the original series and the ending was considerably more emotional. Cool concept as well. I thought the newer one was a little predictable. Still enjoyable though!

I gave up on Bleach.... started getting pretty stupid and not enjoyable. I started recently watching the 7 deadly sins.... it kind of sucks, but there is something enjoyable about it. Only in a Japanese show could you have a main character who is a talking pig and just never explain it!  :D
Logged
robcat2075

*
Offline Offline

Location: Dallas, Texas
Joined: Apr 19, 2009
Posts: 6411

View Profile
« Reply #11 on: May 03, 2017, 10:26AM »

The two finest American animated features, to my taste, are directed by the same guy.

"Iron Giant" (1999) was a big surprise because it was nothing like the fairy tale animated musical form that was almost mandatory then and it was from Warners, who had no track record of successful feature animation.

The few people who saw it admired it so it was very exciting when Brad Bird resurfaced from that box-office mishap, working on something at Pixar that turned out to be "Incredibles." To transition so successfully from 2D to 3D was impressive and he instantly became one of the gods of modern animation.

A big part of his directing was to walk around every day to the animators' desks and instead of just verbally critiquing their shot he would draw on their screen with a dry erase marker... " it needs this shape... the arc needs to go this way...  the spacing needs to be like this..." One of the teachers at my school said "I never really understood spacing until Brad Bird came here."

Now he's working on an "Incredibles" sequel after a couple of live-action movies that seem not to have got him the step up the Hollywood ladder he was aiming for.

 
Logged

Robert Holmén

Hear me as I Play My Horn


Get your Popper, Dotzauer, or Kummer play-alongs!
harrison.t.reed
*
Offline Offline

Location: Colorado
Joined: Apr 5, 2007
Posts: 2757
"Spartan Brass Band!"


View Profile
« Reply #12 on: May 03, 2017, 10:53AM »

Iron Giant was pretty darn good. From an animation perspective it was outstanding. The story was good but not as good as the visuals.

Incredibles got it all right.

What's with Pixar and redheads?

Alfredo Linguini in Ratatouille
Andy's Mom in Toy Story 1
Jessie in Toy Story 2 & Toy Story 3
Syndrome/Buddy Pine and Kari McKeen in The Incredibles
Darla Sherman in Finding Nemo
Merida and several other Characters in Brave (for good reason)
Ellie Fredricksen in Up
Mary in Wall-E

Also, Disney owns Pixar:

Anna in Frozen
Arielle in TLM
Hercules
Peter Pan
Jessica and Roger Rabbit
Quasimodo
Anita from 101 Dalmations
Giselle from Enchanted


It's almost like how the main character in nearly every studio Ghibli movie is not just a girl, but THE SAME girl (with a different name and different hair color, sometimes)
Logged

"My technique is as good as Initial D"
T-396A - Griego 1C
88HTCL - Griego 1C
36H - DE XT105, C+, D Alto Shank
3B/F Silversonic - Griego 1A ss
pBone (with Yellow bell for bright tone)
robcat2075

*
Offline Offline

Location: Dallas, Texas
Joined: Apr 19, 2009
Posts: 6411

View Profile
« Reply #13 on: May 03, 2017, 11:11AM »

The fact that it wasn't yet another movie about a headstrong, independent-minded young girl seeking to break out from the expectations of her family was a huge plus for me.  Good!  I loved every minute of it.

Brad Bird tells of Warner giving him a helpful list of all things that had to be in an animated movie. 

#1? You have to have an "I want" song.   The whole list was like that, clichés that had been beaten to death over the previous 10 years.
Logged

Robert Holmén

Hear me as I Play My Horn


Get your Popper, Dotzauer, or Kummer play-alongs!
harrison.t.reed
*
Offline Offline

Location: Colorado
Joined: Apr 5, 2007
Posts: 2757
"Spartan Brass Band!"


View Profile
« Reply #14 on: May 03, 2017, 11:19AM »

Most Underrated Studio Ghibli Miyazaki film:

Lupin III : Castle Cagliostro

What's not to like about a criminal ripping criminals off?
Logged

"My technique is as good as Initial D"
T-396A - Griego 1C
88HTCL - Griego 1C
36H - DE XT105, C+, D Alto Shank
3B/F Silversonic - Griego 1A ss
pBone (with Yellow bell for bright tone)
robcat2075

*
Offline Offline

Location: Dallas, Texas
Joined: Apr 19, 2009
Posts: 6411

View Profile
« Reply #15 on: May 04, 2017, 10:21AM »

What's with Pixar and redheads?...

As someone with red hair I'll say that red hair seems to be Hollywood's shorthand indicator for awkward/misfit/outlier/non-conformist status (the classic animation protagonist).

It's like how glasses mean "science" and bent nose means "thug."

Only about 1% of the population has it naturally so when you see it, it's a signal that something is unusual.

"Red-headed stepchild" means a child from an affair so, yup, Linguini gets red hair.  :D

It usually also means "female". It's a way of making sure everyone knows the tom-boy girl is still a girl.

like this...




I can't think of many classic movies with red-haired male stars.


Pixar does seem to have gone to the well a bit much on that but there's only two other choices; no one wants a bald cartoon hero. And if you light it right it's potentially more compelling graphically than blond or dark hair.



Logged

Robert Holmén

Hear me as I Play My Horn


Get your Popper, Dotzauer, or Kummer play-alongs!
harrison.t.reed
*
Offline Offline

Location: Colorado
Joined: Apr 5, 2007
Posts: 2757
"Spartan Brass Band!"


View Profile
« Reply #16 on: May 04, 2017, 10:39AM »

Lol why'd you link to my profile?
Logged

"My technique is as good as Initial D"
T-396A - Griego 1C
88HTCL - Griego 1C
36H - DE XT105, C+, D Alto Shank
3B/F Silversonic - Griego 1A ss
pBone (with Yellow bell for bright tone)
robcat2075

*
Offline Offline

Location: Dallas, Texas
Joined: Apr 19, 2009
Posts: 6411

View Profile
« Reply #17 on: May 04, 2017, 10:43AM »

Lol why'd you link to my profile?

Oops.  I guess if I go to my profile and copy the URL it just means "go to the current user's profile". That's why you got your profile.

I've changed the link.
Logged

Robert Holmén

Hear me as I Play My Horn


Get your Popper, Dotzauer, or Kummer play-alongs!
harrison.t.reed
*
Offline Offline

Location: Colorado
Joined: Apr 5, 2007
Posts: 2757
"Spartan Brass Band!"


View Profile
« Reply #18 on: May 04, 2017, 10:45AM »

Cool picture
Logged

"My technique is as good as Initial D"
T-396A - Griego 1C
88HTCL - Griego 1C
36H - DE XT105, C+, D Alto Shank
3B/F Silversonic - Griego 1A ss
pBone (with Yellow bell for bright tone)
robcat2075

*
Offline Offline

Location: Dallas, Texas
Joined: Apr 19, 2009
Posts: 6411

View Profile
« Reply #19 on: May 04, 2017, 11:17AM »

I worked on a modest little film called "The Tin Woodman of Oz" and, indeed, our plucky child protagonist had red hair...



Logged

Robert Holmén

Hear me as I Play My Horn


Get your Popper, Dotzauer, or Kummer play-alongs!
JohnL
Edge Monster

*
Offline Offline

Location: Anaheim, CA, USA
Joined: Aug 1, 2004
Posts: 7228

View Profile WWW
« Reply #20 on: May 04, 2017, 11:33AM »

I don't think it's just the hair color. It's the entire "pigmentation package" that emphasizes that the character is in some way "different" from the norm. Light colored eyes, light skin, and freckles. Freckles, in particular, are associated with the "tomboy" image, regardless of hair color.
Logged

Question change.
Embrace progress.
Take the time to learn the difference.
robcat2075

*
Offline Offline

Location: Dallas, Texas
Joined: Apr 19, 2009
Posts: 6411

View Profile
« Reply #21 on: May 04, 2017, 11:59AM »

I don't think it's just the hair color. It's the entire "pigmentation package" that emphasizes that the character is in some way "different" from the norm. Light colored eyes, light skin, and freckles. Freckles, in particular, are associated with the "tomboy" image, regardless of hair color.

That's true, but I suspect most film executives think, "I've paid for a tomboy, I want the whole tomboy with red hair" and in animation, there's no question about whether you can cast one or not.
Logged

Robert Holmén

Hear me as I Play My Horn


Get your Popper, Dotzauer, or Kummer play-alongs!
robcat2075

*
Offline Offline

Location: Dallas, Texas
Joined: Apr 19, 2009
Posts: 6411

View Profile
« Reply #22 on: May 05, 2017, 07:35AM »

There's a "Trombonist's Time Machine" thread elsewhere.  What time would you go back to if you could?

If there were an animator's time machine I'd go back to 1928 and walk into Disney's place, right when almost everyone else had walked out and he was hiring people who couldn't animate.  The people who got on board then caught a huge wave.
Logged

Robert Holmén

Hear me as I Play My Horn


Get your Popper, Dotzauer, or Kummer play-alongs!
Ketch22
*
Offline Offline

Location: Canada
Joined: Nov 21, 2016
Posts: 13

View Profile
« Reply #23 on: May 07, 2017, 10:33AM »

And I know my post was pretty Japan heavy, but maybe someone else has heard of good animation coming out in the states that isn't Pixar?

I think an ex-Disney traditional animator did a series called "Bitey of Brackenwood" entirely in flash. It's outstanding.

If I had the talent, I'd animate something cel-style in flash to go with "Motorbike Concerto".

Not in the States, but Canada. The National Film Board has an extensive library of Canadian 2D animation from shorts to feature length films using techniques from drawing on film (Norman McLaren - one of my favourites), cel animation, stop motion, sand drawing, etc. Many are award winning, including Oscar nominations (and a few winners). Go to www.NFB.ca and then go into the animation section. You'll spend hours there if you are into the various forms of 2D animation.

K22
Logged
harrison.t.reed
*
Offline Offline

Location: Colorado
Joined: Apr 5, 2007
Posts: 2757
"Spartan Brass Band!"


View Profile
« Reply #24 on: May 07, 2017, 01:53PM »

I can't wait to check that out.
Logged

"My technique is as good as Initial D"
T-396A - Griego 1C
88HTCL - Griego 1C
36H - DE XT105, C+, D Alto Shank
3B/F Silversonic - Griego 1A ss
pBone (with Yellow bell for bright tone)
robcat2075

*
Offline Offline

Location: Dallas, Texas
Joined: Apr 19, 2009
Posts: 6411

View Profile
« Reply #25 on: May 07, 2017, 02:13PM »

Not in the States, but Canada. The National Film Board ...


"The Big Snit" is one of the immortal classics.  Good!
Logged

Robert Holmén

Hear me as I Play My Horn


Get your Popper, Dotzauer, or Kummer play-alongs!
Pages: 1 2 [All]   Go Up
Print
Jump to: